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The Westworld Thread - Full of Spoilers! - Season 2!


#1623

I mean, not even quite.
In the original movie, the people in charge utterly fail in stopping the uprising/revolt. The hosts are only stopped due to their internal mechanisms shutting down over time.

Which could have been cool to do here in a sense where they actually have to confront their imminent mortality.
If they wanted to spend ages on some philosophical bent…that could have been a good route to go that also could have been exciting.

Like Logan’s Run…but with Robots.


#1624

The military flies in and bombs the shit out of the park. The end.

or

Someone activates the kill switch in all the hosts. The end.

or

The hosts kill every human and then have nothing more to do, so the park is quarantined. The end.

or

Competent human security land and kill the hosts.

or

The upload new code in the hosts that makes them stop working.

It’s a robot rebellion in a controlled isolated location. There’s only so many ways it can end. HBO aren’t about to fund an epic series about a robot uprising and taking over of humanity. We already have shitty shows about that and they wouldn’t decorate that series in the trappings of Westworld. This was clearly a small scale show about what it is to be a robot and what consciousnesses is/reality is. The writers just couldn’t tell that story properly and they resorted to a bunch of tricks that eventually screwed them up.


#1625

I know, I was agreeing that there is a definite expiration date on it and within that they could have done something really interesting.

But in the end, it seems that HBO did exactly that.


#1626

I struggle not to bash it despite the production values and acting. Right up until three episodes ago I had faith that there was a point to dropping out of entertainment mode and into something deeper. When you have everything there - money, incredible visuals, amazing actors - it’s just unforgivable to turn a premise as exciting as slaves turning on their masters into something so droll.


#1627

Oh yeah, what the writers have done is utterly unforgivable, nearly as bad as the writers of BSG and Lost. You can’t make your whole premise a magic trick and then fuck up the ending. That’s just a huge waste of everyone’s time. They’ve betrayed the viewers and I expect HBO to come down on them hard (though both writers are so fucking smug in their interviews I think it’ll take some time for them to ever admit they’re at fault - no doubt they’ll blame the viewer for being stupid).

The big elephant is HBO - they needed this show to work, and I’d estimated half the audience just said fuck it. Once GOT ends I’d expect loads of people to be dumping their subscription and HBO is starting to be left behind by Amazon and Netflix. They’ve always coasted on maybe 1-2 good shows at any given time, but they’ve had a huge number of strikeouts and are becoming increasingly irrelevant. They had a good thing, HBO was the place where you got different TV, but the cable companies have improved their game and the streamers are kicking ass. And Disney are about to enter the fight. If I was some HBO executive I’d be on heart pills and calling for the beating of Jonathan Nolan.


#1628

Cowboy slaves even.


#1629

Wow what a clusterfuck of an episode… =/

Even the production took a nose-dive on this one (some very shady fx shots)… This was incredibly poorly written, and I’m sorry but did they just pretty much kill everyone except for the 2 least likeable characters (3 if you count lesser Hemsworth), but at least this season he was likeable)? They completely destroyed Dolores this season and Bernard has been an utter bore… wtf were they thinking? Is anyone here interested in watching a 3rd season with Dolores and Bernard as the focus?

Also, what was the whole point of it? they basically killed everyone and only some random bots sruvived in VR paradise, what a shit ending. And soooooooooo many plot-holes that were completely unadressed… ugh…

Really a waste of great production values, and honestly acting too, even though I don’t like the characters at least the actors were great for the most part.


#1630

It’s very rare where everyone’s issues are the same across the board as much as they are here. It amazes me that no one on a production level seemingly made any attempt to stand up to the writers and tell them they needed to do better.


#1631

Ok saw it, it was not good. The show feels like they only forgot to add an actual shark to that lake so the characters could jump it.

But my take on what’s wrong is very simple. I like the basic ideas, I like the characters and I like most of the plot now it’s unravelled.

What I don’t like is the convoluted way it was delivered. That’s it.

Take out Bernard’s scrambled sense of cause and effect and you’re left with a perfectly decent continuation of season one. Had it been presented in chronological order it would’ve felt a bit padded here and there, but it would’ve been far more effective and a LOT less irritating.

I don’t mind the show runners having pretentions to explore the human condition, but the pretentious way they handled all of it was counter productive.

We’ll see if there’s a consensus of viewer opinion out there and if it affects how season 3 is developed?

But more wibbly wobbly timey whimey is not what I’m looking for.


#1632

NuDolores arrives at RealWorldOne Station, encounters a metal detector for the first time and is promptly carted off to jail, the bag o’ metal balls confiscated.

Hey! At least it makes sense!


#1633

The problem with the show it the incredibly lazy writting… since the first episode to be honest, but it’s gotten waaaay worse. But even from the start it’s been one of the most inconsistent shows I’ve ever seen, it’s like they don’t even know that word… and it’s kinda hard getting invested in a show where seemingly anything goes and nothing really matters =/


#1634

I bailed on Westworld after the first two episodes of season one because it just didn’t grab me, so I’m not really sure what’s going on there.

I didn’t really object to the way BSG ended.

Lost, on the other hand, I thought crawled up its own ass as it wound down. The first half, or thereabouts, was telling one story and then they seemingly abandoned that story and went off in another direction that was neither interesting nor satisfying.

Sounds like Westworld accomplished the same thing in twenty episodes.

I think HBO, for all of their acclaim, can really let their series spiral out of control. True Detective’s first season was pretty good but ultimately left me wanting more; the second season was a mess. The Sopranos started strong, but I thought it started meandering around in the third season and gave an ending that is, depending on your point of view, brilliant, frustrating, ambiguous, or a big middle finger to the audience. And then there was John From Cincinatti. Makes me a little nervous about Game of Thrones…


#1635

The only frustrating thing about the Sopranos finale was Meadow’s parking skills :wink:

Agreed about BSG. I think the only things I didn’t like about the final stretch was the first half of Season 3 and just the dialogue quality of the last 3 minutes of the finale.


#1636

Y’all are too soft on BSG. Soon as All Along the Watchtower started playing the show went to shit.


#1637

Nah Adama on the hill and “My father was a farmer” and allll was forgiven.

Until the last two minutes.


#1638

There were moments of brilliance in the writing of season 2. Moments when the show felt almost as deep and clever as it was in season 1. The idea that humans were looking for immortality was fundamentally a good concept to hang the series on. I liked the Writer’s arc, and pretty much every scene he was in was good. I found Teddy’s arc compelling in a train-wreck sort of way.

But the moments were surrounded by so much garbage :frowning:


#1639

A flicker of what could have been in the cave of what the fuck is this?!


#1640

So, Birth of a Nation is on in the background while I work and it really highlights just how badly the ball was fumbled in Westworld.

To take the concept from the movie to TV you are obviously going to muddy the waters - show more than one side to things - the hosts aren’t just robot killing machines broken loose but deserve the right not to be slaves.

One of the most important part of any story like this is humanizing the slaves, letting the audience empathize with them. Season 1 did a pretty good job of this whereas Season 2 completely forgot how to. It highlighted no real empathetic struggles - except for the one good episode following the Native Americans path. In that episode it didn’t matter if the mystery was nonsensical, there was a human story that we felt.

Anyway, none of this is going to help now. It’s a real pity though. With the sensibilities of something like Birth of a Nation you wouldn’t even need mysteries and cheap twists - or at least ones which don’t have any emotional impact. What an absolute waste of great potential.


#1641

Someone went all in on us rooting for Delores but then wrote her as this terrible villain. And I guess they want us to root for Bernard but he’s so befuddled it’d be a mercy just to shoot him. Amazingly there’s no one to root for. We had Maeve but then they ended her character arc (her daughter is safe) and then killed her.

It’s spectacularly dumb.


#1642

That’s a perfect summation, Jim.

I was also rooting for William’s daughter for that brief prologue in the Raj. But yeah then they wasted her too.