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The Westworld Thread - Full of Spoilers! - Season 2!


#1563

I think it’s fallen into the trap of “Nobody is as smart as the writers”. What’s missing is any character who can bring the audience into the the show by being able to figure things out. Otherwise it’s a muddle of confusion. I think I liked last week’s episode so much because Akecheta had some understanding of the world he lives in, was able to act within it - and then fell to the producer’s meta-concept that people cannot speak in simple declarative sentences. “Don’t kill me! I am putting down the tomahawk!” Not parading around the cabin like a Big Evil Carrot during a debate!

And three of the actors are now starring in a commercial for some sort of bottled water. Movin’ on up!


#1564

Like, you know, actual guests trying to survive.
Such as the woman from The Raj could have been. Before they decided to tie her into the boring ass plot.

This show completely misses the actual appeal of this premise so hard.


#1565

I think it’s more that the story has a limit. Once the robots rebel there’s only so long before the rebellion is squashed. The end. And when it’s cowboys against modern military there’s not much to watch there (even if all the security guys can’t seem to fight).

Clearly they didn’t want to go full Jurassic Park, having a time jump into the future to kick off the second season with all the hosts dead telegraphs that they’re going for a different kind of story here. So we’re in the dark about the Valley Beyond and what possibly could happen next. My main issue is twofold - death isn’t real, and now characters can be anything. MIB might not be a human, his entire experience might all be a simulation. There’s nothing at stake when nothing is real. Ford gets shot but he’s still walking around. Time jumps make the story more confusing and not less. MIB killed his daughter last night and you don’t know how to react because you don’t know if she’s real or not (I don’t think it was his daughter, the huge wooden box macguffin nonsense made that clear). It’s superbly shot and acted but the story is all over the place.


#1566

They could have taken the chance to make a fresh spin on that set-up. Instead they went for what is an even more tired framework about “AI” and “Cognition”, and added in perhaps the most trite mystery about industrial intrigue.

One of the best things about Jurassic Park, book and movie, is how that suddenly stops mattering because hey the park is going to hell and people are in it…while in the show it just keeps coming back in more boring iterations.

People trying to survive in an amusement park that’s going to hell is the whole purpose. Removing that…and you’re left with nothing.


#1567

That’s a 2 hour story, not a 40 hour, 4 season story.


#1568

This version was never about the humans. Last season wasn’t about them either. This reboot has the hosts as the main characters, always has.

Ford and the others were just there to provide contrast; this is what humans are.

The showrunners said from the beginning that the show is about the rise of a new species; the hosts.


#1569

It could have only lasted the one season. There are multiple parks.
Have roaming groups of survivors. Normal guests who wanted nothing but to have a good vacation.

Make threads about them and just the insanity of being stuck in a place made up to be a fiction.

They have a huge playground to play with, instead it’s discount PKD.

Yeah, but then the thing is that the show still focuses on humans about half the time…that’s half the show spent plodding about…and it’s not like the hosts are at all interesting either.


#1570

And that’s the real problem. I was really interested in them last season, but now… not so much.


#1571

I was only interested in them as set-up to contrast the belief that we would be seeing humans trying to survive against them. To create a conflict and tension between the two groups.

Not…what this season ended up doing.

So, I’m ready to write off both seasons. This series was a huge misfire.


#1572

That’s the Walking Dead. And it’s shite.

I think a miss was having such terrible worlds. We have robots that can be anything, so lets have feudal Japan and Colonial India? Fuck that. I want zombie world, robot world, sex nyppho world, James Bond world, Gandalf world, fucking give me a world deep in the belly of hell fighting 10 story demons.


#1573

Walking Dead is crap.
But it’s also the premise of Westworld and it’s perfected version: Jurassic Park.

The only interesting/entertaining things this series has done have been the things that tie back into that. That tie into the inanity and chaos of this place as a park and how people interact with it.

And, for some reason, that’s only a small percentage of it. They thought they were smarter than the story.


#1574

I think there is a huge element of some very basic characterization across the board. They do very little with their best characters and the main characters are all so utterly bland. And actually seem to get blander as drama happens too them.

Bernard - Boring now. Deloris - Boring now. Teddy - Made him boring as a plot device. Hale - Full blown evil CEO trope now. Boring. Man in Black - Boring and nonsensical. Ford - Full blown God trope.

Maeve, the one main character who has had any genuinely worthwhile character progression has been lying on a table for three episodes.

Last time I gave this lack of a fuck was the end credits of The Last Jedi. Maeve and some of the side characters are the only people I give a shit about. If that scene of Maeve and Ford wasn’t in this episode I’m not sure I’d even keep watching. I had faith they would pull things together but they’ve probably left it too long and too open. We’ll see.


#1575

As I said; this was never intended to be Jurassic Park, it’s Blade Runner crossed with Spartacus.

And now I’ve typed that, I wish the show had lived up to that description.


#1576

That’s what I loved about Jonathan Nolan’s Person of Interest. It started off as a fairly standard procedural with a bit of a cyberpunk flavor. You got to know and care about the characters. But the show began to evolve into something completely different. It became about human’s interaction with technology and the rise of ASIs and what that would mean.

I miss PoI. :cry:


#1577

I know, and I wish it did too.

But since it didn’t, all I’m saying is that they did end up wasting a perfectly serviceable premise.


#1578

I see this show as a retelling of Genesis. And it could be great with that in mind (and it’s certainly tried to go there). Ford is God, Maeve is Michael and Delores is Lucifer. But all the other crap keeps getting in the way. And wasted characters like Teddy, Billy and fucking Bernard (I wish they’d just shoot Bernard) are unwelcome distractions.

Maybe the last episode saves this, but if it doesn’t this going to be one of the greatest collapses ever for a TV show.


#1579

No, no, no. Dolores is Eve, Teddy was Adam (easily discarded). Bernarnold is Lucifer, taking the fall for Ford. William is a pain in the ass.


#1580

The last episode will be, as we saw at the end of last year, partly concerned with when things have been happening.

Playing with timelines is something show has carried over, and I’m not a huge fan of what they’ve done with it so far, but next week they should establish the true order of the events we’ve been watching.

I hope that helps tie it all together, but the fact remains that the episodes that contained those events were far too variable in quality themselves.


#1581

Just watched the latest episode.

Ugh. Can’t we just nuke all the parks from orbit, just to be sure this crap doesn’t continue?

I think this season has disappointed a lot of people. From my own personal sampling, people who enjoyed the first season gave up on this one a couple of episodes in.

Regardless of how this season ends, I hope there is a major course correction for Season 3. Yet, irreparable damage may have been done and there’s no saving the show.


#1582

Not surprisingly, next week’s episode is slotted to run 90 minutes too.