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The Music Thread


#363

They’re pub-rock.


#364

I’d always considered them as the definition of Britpop. Though it seems this article identifies Britpop as a form of rock.

Or a Beatles cover band. I think the Beatles would fall more in the pop category now.


#365

Britpop is often seen as a derivation or subgenre of pub rock, but really it’s like Grunge - a catchall term for a lot of musically diverse bands with a common point of origin and a repudiation of what as largely popular beforehand.

Like, Nirvana, Soundgarden, Pearl Jam and Alice in Chains have some similarities, but none of the 4 are really the same. They’re all from Seattle though, and their styles of music are a push back against mid-late 80s hard rock and metal.

Similarly, look at the 4 bands mentioned in the preview of britpop - Oasis, Blur, Suede and Pulp. Suede and Pulp are sorta similar, but Blur and Oasis are radically different from each other and the other two bands listed.


#366

Yeah I think in truth Britpop was more a label for a lot of acts coming out at the same time rather than a musical style. A lot of it could only be ‘pop’ if you use the loosest definition possible. Google some definitions and they include from The Spice Girls to Radiohead.

It’s more akin to the way Grant Morrison uses the word ‘pop’, to mean of the moment and the zeitgeist rather than a bubblegum pop single.

Some are very much pub rock but Blur only flirted with that a little, there’s a lot of what I would call indie in there. Elastica or Suede don’t really sound anything like Oasis or Ocean Colour Scene other than they use guitars.


#367

Or there’s a subgenre of Industrial/EBM called futurepop, which is basically industrial dance music, but not especially harsh on the ears.


#368

Britpop didn’t have a whole lot of impact here outside of Oasis’s short-lived run. A few others were a bit one hit wonders here (like The Verve) with a lot of them having a somewhat similar Beatles-esque sound and look. That’s why I generally associate Britpop with Oasis.

I’m not sure I’ve ever even heard Suede or Pulp and that was during my prime music listening days. I agree Blur is quite different and more of what I would consider alternative. Radiohead were probably the ones included in some of those groupings that actually had the most staying power in the US. Ironically, Bush probably lasted longer than Oasis in the American market but they were much more in line with American style alternative music.


#369

Amusingly, Bitter Sweet Symphony was initially a bit of a comeback single for The Verve, and wound up being their biggest hit ever.

Bush really came up through the alternative rock/grunge scene, they’d never have been considered Britpop over here.


#370

Bush were one of those oddities where they were far more popular in the US than the UK despite coming from there. I doubt most Brits would know who they are, they had one top 20 hit there but 13 in the US.

There are examples the other way like The Strokes and Scissor Sisters were two of the biggest bands in the UK in the early 00s but fairly ignored in their native US.


#371

I agree with all the above, Britpop was more of a cultural movement (to give it a pompous term) than a defined musical genre.

Something more akin to the Swinging Sixties (I think quite deliberately and contrivedly).


#372

This is really the US term for what the Brits call ‘indie’ music. The two are interchangable.

The US has the ‘alternative’ chart and the UK the ‘indie’ chart. You can question the accuracy of both terms as a lot of alternative music actually ends up very mainstream and a lot of indie bands are actually on major labels but it doesn’t really matter as we get the drift of what they both mean.


#373

For fans of vinyl records:


#374

Words like grunge and Britpop are just marketing terms, a way to say “if you like X then you’ll like Y.” And generally effective even when the band’s sound nothing alike.

Elastica despised Blur and Oasis, and being lumped in with them. I don’t recall the stories of them turning down the money they got from it. (I can’t speak for the KLF).


#375

That must have been awkward when the singers of both were in a relationship for 7 years. :smile:


#376

Plus, Stock, Aiken and Waterman were an indie label while mass-producing bubblegum pop in the 80s.


#377

Yup and after that they changed the way they defined the chart to a musical style as people were angry the top 10 were all Sonia and Sinitta and other pure pop tunes and the likes of The Cure were excluded as they were on a subsidiary of Polydor.


#378

Ha sorry I meant Oasis.


#379

After doing a Google search here is where I got that from. I guess she hated Oasis and while she did date Damon she thought Great Escape was shit.


#380

“Indie” really is an unfortunate term, though, and I wish we had a better one.

Almost every new album I buy now is on an “independent” label. You would not recognise any of them as “indie” music.

“Alternative” doesn’t work either. Because everything that isn’t “mainstream” (whatever that may be) is, by definition, alternative.

My other terminology bugbear is “world music”, but that’s so heinous it needs a whole rant to itself :smiley:


#381

She’s not wrong, The Great Escape does touch on parody and I hated Country House and Charmless Man (it was always ironic that that big chart confrontation featured the two worst singles either Blur or Oasis released). She was clearly hanging out with the band at that time from the interview though and says even Blur’s lead guitarist hated it.

It does have The Universal on it though which is great.


#382

Really, all of Oasis’ singles are the worst one.