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Star Wars Movie Thread


#3737

The Godfather approach?

Yes, villains need someone more villainous as an antagonist. See also ‘Scarface’ and ‘Carlito’s Way’.

But I’m not sure a Vadar movie is a big draw? Vadar himself is great, but a whole movie with him as protagonist? I don’t personally think it’s a $1bn movie.


#3738

I don’t think you need to go that far - just make him a villain building his rep among other villains. In the same way that Tony Soprano was a compelling lead character but also clearly a very nasty piece of work.

(Yes, I know Vader is never going to be as complex or nuanced a character as that, but I think people can enjoy watching a villain without having to like them.)


#3739

Awesome :laughing:


#3740

I thought the next post about the ‘initial’ villain would have tipped my hand.


#3741

Let’s use the tags on actual spoilers, I could care less about being spoiled for Star Wars at this point but I haven’t seen IW yet!


#3742

I really they would stop with all of these fucking prequels and move forward with the universe, already.

Wake me up when we get a Star Wars movie that takes place 50 years after Last Jedi.


#3743

A large part of the fun in the Vader Down story Marvel did was Vader utterly massacring rebels left, right and centre. (It couldn’t really sustain that level of carnage, but you have new respect for Luke for later duelling a force of absolute death twice.)

The way the new material has handled Vader has been very good - if he turns up, you’re fucked. But I don’t think that can work as an entire film, it’s better suited to comics or a short sequence like what R1 did.


#3744

I guess part of it is how far we want to see inside Vader’s head, too. Part of the complaints about the prequels was that they humanised him too much and stripped away his mystique.

But I don’t think you necessarily have to do that to make him the star of the show. Imagine making a film called Darth Vader in the same spirit that Cameron made The Terminator. A tight chase/action thriller in the Star Wars universe. He can’t be bargained with, he can’t be reasoned with, he doesn’t feel pity, or remorse, or fear, and he absolutely will not stop, ever, until you are cut in half with a lightsaber.

I’d watch that.


#3745

I have trouble taking Vader seriously after the prequels.


#3746

Why? If nothing else, the PT establishes that Anakin was damn good at killin’. Does Vader need more that that?

(Hell, compared to his grandkid, Anakin’s positively stable!)

To me, the flaw of the PT is it doesn’t establish Anakin as sufficiently heroic for the tragedy of his fall to work.


#3747

I can see that selling to Gen X, but I’m not sure it appeals to a kids market. Disney need to figure out who their audience is for Star Wars. Force Awakens was for all ages, but Rogue One and Last Jedi feel like they’re for adults. Solo seems to be adults to, essentially Oceans 11 in space.


#3748

#3749

I agree that it doesn’t seem like they have a single audience in mind with these movies, some skew younger than others. I guess that could end up as a strength, but if it’s intentional then they probably need to differentiate them better in their marketing.


#3750

Huh, for me it is actually the opposite. The PT doesn’t establish him as sufficiently disturbed for his fall to be credible. They were trying to paint him as a heroic figure and then suddenly the hero thinks, “hell yeah I am gonna kill a bunch of kids.” I just didn’t buy it. His turn to the dark side wasn’t tragic, it was kinda absurdly comedic.


#3751

#3752

Anakin in the prequels is presented as the character who allows himself to feel the most, and keeps getting told he shouldn’t do that. It’s a true tragedy, of being swallowed whole by the world around you. He’s always trying to do the right thing, but no one really cares about his best interests after Qui-Gon’s death. Qui-Gon saw potential in him. The other guy who sees potential in him is a manipulative bastard named Palpatine. And guess who’s still around for the second and third movies? When we first meet him Anakin is defensive about being a slave, preferring that he not be seen as one. And to reach his potential he has to leave his mother behind. Then fast-forward a decade and he’s a Jedi acting more as a peer to Obi-Wan than a pupil. The Obi-Wan we meet on Tatooine has become far more like Qui-Gon, a pragmatist, but the younger Obi-Wan is a true believer whose only shortcoming is his inability to rein Anakin in (we learn he also sees Anakin as his brother). And then Anakin reunites with Padme, who at first refuses to see him as anything but the little boy she once knew. To Anakin it’s a nightmare; he never wants to be seen as what he actually is. Inside the head of Darth Vader? Someone who absolutely loathes what he has become, and that self-loathing creates a permanently volatile personality, who utterly lacks the compassion that once defined Anakin. He has lost hope. (Heh.) He reunites with his mother but only after she’s been kidnapped and pretty much tortured to death, and she dies in front of him, and he slaughters the whole Tusken Raider village. He confesses to Padme and this exposure to his vulnerability confirms the sincerity of his love for her. She stops seeing him as a little boy. Then they secretly get married. He’s disobeyed the Jedi edict against strong emotions one too many times, made one too many lasting relationships. (Likely potential Jedi were recruited young mostly so they didn’t formed familial attachments.) Then Palpatine creates a new fear of loss within him, and shows him the way to overcome it, but of course all he wants is to draft him into the Sith. This leads to a final confrontation with his Jedi counterpart, Obi-Wan, and once completely severed from his old life, Anakin is free to become Darth Vader, the perfect manifestation of the Force, at least as the Sith see it. And of course ironically his son Luke brings balance to the Force (for a time, anyway) because of his devotion to his father, something that the Jedi in their prime would’ve strongly discouraged. The sequels have his grandson find his greatest rival in someone who has no link at all to the old ways, and her greatest stumbling block is yearning for a family that abandoned her. But she has far more Jedi in her than Sith. The Sith are above all defined by selfish pursuits. Were Anakin’s original goals selfish? Or could he have found a balance? Did his son? Will Rey?


#3753

Kind of funny that we’re looking at the same thing from opposite poles and drawing the same conclusion!


#3754

This is a pretty funny take on the division of Star Wars fans. Her delivery gets a little annoying but I’ve developed a high tolerance for teenager’s high speed ramblings. :wink:


#3755

#3756