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Star Wars Movie Thread


#2348

oh, man, now I want fries with garlic mayo.


#2349

As one does.


#2350

No, no, that’s just wrong! :open_mouth:


#2351

I remember reading somewhere that he was named after a stuffed animal Abrams’ daughter had called Poe, but it seems too much of a coincidence so maybe it’s a reference to both.

Would love some garlic mayo right now, on anything really.


#2352

#2353

Further proof that Yoda was a fucking idiot.

This is something that’s been driving me nuts about Star Wars.

Yoda is always presented as being wise and knowledgeable, but everything he says and does is wrong. Every piece of advice he gives is wrong.

In TPM he doesn’t believe the Sith are active. He bungles the crisis on Naboo. He lets Obi-Wan train Anakin in tne ways of the Force… we know how that turned out.

In AOTC he brings the clone army under the control of the Jedi. The same clones who will turn on them. He’s wrong about Dooku.

In ROTS, he and Obi-Wan split up and confront Vader and Palpatine separately.

In the prequels, Yoda wandered into every single trap Palpatine had set for him.

In ESB, Yoda doesn’t want to train Luke. He tells Luke not to save his friends. He tells Luke not to give into his anger. He tells Luke that Vader can’t be redeemed.

In ROTJ, Luke gives into his anger to protect his sister and redeems his father, which leads to the death of Palpatine.

And I don’t get what I’m supposed to take out of this.

Yoda is never presented as a chump in any of the ancillary material – he’s always the wise Jedi Master – but what we’re shown onscreen, when you stop and think about it, says otherwise.

Was this George Lucas’ intent? Or did he just not realize what he was writing?


#2354

I think a good response to this is that true wisdom does not pretend to be infallible, to trust oneself rather than try and force others to conform to you, as the Sith do. It sounds backwards (…like Yoda, I guess), but being constantly disappointed is actually better than always getting your way. It gives you something that is bigger than yourself to strive for, that elusive “perfect” that in the right and truly selfless (Jedi) mindset is unattainable, but always worth fighting for.

Which is to say, being grumpy isn’t the worst thing you can be. Actually it might be the best. All hail Seinfeld!


#2355

I think all that Yoda stuff is intentional.

In the prequels we’re meant to see that the Jedi aren’t perfect, and that Palpatine was able to exploit their overly-rigid systems of thinking and was powerful enough to cloud their ability to use the Force. That means that even Yoda has to be unable to stop it - I think we’re meant to feel slightly shocked when we see such a supposedly wise and powerful Jedi beaten and cowed at the end of Episode III. I think the prequels do a pretty good job of showing him doing what he thinks is right while unwittingly enabling Palpatine’s plans to succeed (something that the audience can perceive much more easily given that we know how things have to end up).

In the original trilogy, he’s meant to be the wise old master who’s a bit too set in his ways (and a bit eccentric from being alone for so long). Luke breaking the rules and still managing to succeed is deliberate - we’re meant to see that his passion and belief in the possibility of redemption are strengths and not the weaknesses Yoda thinks they are.

(It’s also notable that the two main ‘hero’ Jedi in the prequels, Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan, are fairly rebellious and free-thinking as Jedi go, and don’t always agree with Yoda.)

I think setting Yoda up as a great and powerful Jedi through exposition is one of those times when telling rather than showing is ok. We need to see a seemingly infallible character show himself to be fallible - and while you could spend a lot of time showing Yoda be super-smart and powerful, it’d probably be pretty boring (the closest they got is probably the Dooku fight at the end of Episode II, and that ended up feeling like a bit of a gratuitous ‘Yoda as a badass’ scene).


#2356

He’s a right muppet.


#2357

There is a bit of a theme though that the Jedi give up very easily. Yoda goes off to live on his own in a swamp, Obi Wan goes off to live on his own in a desert and Luke goes off to live on his own on a craggy island and fuck whatever nastiness is happening in the galaxy.


#2358

Obi-Wan goes to watch over Luke, though, in fairness. And I guess we might learn more about why Luke went into exile in the new movie.

Yoda is the only one who really feels like he just gives up. I wonder if we’ll see more of him and the other Force Ghosts in TLJ. Maybe he can make his excuses then.


#2359

Yeah but is he any good at it? It’s really just coincidence that Luke wasn’t at home to be fried by the stormtroopers along with his aunt and uncle because R2 does a runner. :smile:

(Okay there’s a lot of scope there that the Force is advising him).


#2360

I don’t think the movies give you much of a clue either way (although there have been some good stories in the comics about him being a presence in Luke’s early life without Luke realising it).

Either way, though, it doesn’t really have any bearing on whether he’s fully given up or not. The original trilogy implies (and the prequel trilogy makes even more explicit) that he goes to Tatooine to be near Luke and watch over him, not just to bog off to a swamp like Yoda.

He might be crap at it, but at least he’s making an effort. :slight_smile:


#2361

I prefer to think he swamped off to a bog.


#2362

The wording was intentional. :wink:


#2363

It’s looking like the level of interest in A Certain Point of View was way, way under-estimated by booksellers.

I’ve my copy, but a few acquaintances elsewhere are having quite the difficulty in the acquisition of one.


#2364

It’s certainly worth considering that if Yoda had remained active he would’ve been a constant target, and he and Palpatine had already (to my mind) fought to a definitive draw, leaving no other option. Any Jedi (like Obi-Wan) remaining would never, by extension, have been safe. And any hope for the future of Skywalker’s kids would’ve been lost, too.


#2365

The evil empire delivered mine a few days ago. It’s good stuff so far.


#2366

The latter.

Look, everybody in the original trilogy behaves like idiots. And certainly all of the wise Jedi we see in the council.

Where ESB is concerned, I think it is demonstrated that Yoda was actually right: Luke was too eager to confront Vader, and he paid with the loss of his hand and an ally. It was sheer luck that he got out of it alive - so Yoda’s advice was correct in this case.

And that is because Lawrence Kasdan can actually write a damn, and George Lucas can’t.

In fact, “George Lucas is a bad writer” is the answer to every question anyone might have about the prequels.


#2367

Nothing is gonna make me watch TPM again, but wasn’t it Ki Adi Mundi (the Jedi with the tall head) who said the Sith were no more? And I’m pretty sure Yoda was opposed to training Anakin.

I think Yoda realized the Jedi were doomed.