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Star Trek: Discovery - discussing S01E15, "Will You Take My Hand?"


#1764

I think this season you have to take the first two episodes as prologue and last two as epilogue, ep 13 was a perfect place to finish, but the last two episodes didn’t get us that much farther - like @Lorcan_Nagle I see DISCO more as character journey, but I’m not sure they needed two episodes to get us where we got to.

I did really enjoy the Orion Market idea and loved the first fully empowered Orion gun dealer - a far cry from slave girl. Orion slave boy was as much as you could probably do to help even out that sexism, but the whole scene I was busy rewinding as the accompanying slave girl is the spitting image of an ex of mine. She lives in the US now and I genuinely thought it was her under the green for a lot more than a moment. :astonished:

So I think like everyone it was a come down from the excitement of the mirror world arc, but I still enjoyed how the characters were left and thought it was quite perfect in that regard - I actually thought the final moment would be someone we knew as the new Captain but as soon as the distress signal came through I know someone was about to say Captain Pike’s name. Big smile on my face. Even bigger with the Enterprise turning up.

That wonderful music kicking in at the end completely made this episode end the series on a high for me and not feel as anti-climactic.


#1765

My favourite crazy speculation is that the new captain is going to be Number One


#1766

That would be awesome. Especially as they were originally considering calling Burnham that.


#1767

She would be the perfect character for it, I agree with you and @YoungDuke


#1768

I do have to admit though, I’ll be disappointed at losing Saru as Captain.


#1769

Oh, and I have to say I saw so glad that when Sarek pinned Burnham’s insignia on her uniform it didn’t come with a promotion to Captain, because really, she shouldn’t be a captain just yet (obviously she needs to learn how to be a great leader by studying Tilly), and like @ParkerMcCombe said, Saru really should be Discovery’s captain.

I’m working on two hopes for next year: Either the ship never makes it to Vulcan on account of being dragged into various crises, or they go through captains like Murphy Brown did secretaries


#1770

The first is definitely my favourite out of those but wonderful Murphy Brown reference, I was worried I’d never see another one of those.


#1771

Never say never…


#1772

There’s also the proven fact that regardless of the results she’s a maverick. And Starfleet will have that sort of captain soon enough. Honestly it ought to be a little like the Worf situation that developed in Deep Space Nine (although that one I didn’t agree with), where she’s permanently barred from the captain’s seat. People who start wars, as she did, even if she ended it, too, even if she ultimately upholds the ideal when even the brass won’t…This whole season was in some ways a riff on Admiral Marcus in Into Darkness, if Marcus and Kirk were transportered into a single (RoboCop-ish, runaway train-stopping) dude.


#1773

New character in series 2: Mor-phee B’rown, a journalist from the Federation News Service spending a few weeks on board to see what the heroes of the Klingon War do when they shift back to being the crew of a research vessel. The whole time she’s there, she gets into moralistic arguments with the ship’s captain (different each week), and queries members of the quartermaster corps about when her quarters will be decorated to her specifications.

There’s a great follow-up to that in the TNG novels after Worf returns to Starfleet and rejoins the crew of the Enterprise, eventually rising to the rank of Commander and first officer. Picard addresses his disgrace and talks about how he can continue to redeem himself, and his climb from Commander to Captain is possible but difficult.


#1774

The best news for him is that Klingons have long lives. I think technically when he was shown as old along with everyone else in “All Good Things…,” that was probably a mistake, unless they look old for a really long time. Like that Patrick Stewart fellow. Or Spock.


#1775

Shut-Up-And-Take-My-Money-Fry


#1776

Everyone in Trek secondary canon lives forever. IIRC Chekov, Uhura, and maybe Sulu are still active in Starfleet in the post-Destiny era!


#1777

The funniest thing I ever heard of in the books was Sisko’s successor being a hundred years old (already) and…still just a commander. In retrospect it really sounds like an in-joke.


#1778

Elias Vaughan was Kira’s XO rather than Sisko’s replacement, and was IMO a pretty well-written character. There were reasons he remained a commander, related to his time as a special operations type. His transfer to DS9 was one of the first times he served as a regular Starfleet officer.

And then they killed him off in the Typhon Pact books for no good reason


#1779

No, I know the general outline of the character and/or situation. He was Sisko’s replacement insofar as he was Starfleet’s liaison to the station, which Kira was now understood as qualified to run.


#1780

Ah right, I get you. Definitely the case until Bajor joined the Federation, at which point he was just the station XO.


#1781

Yeah, I’d agree with a lot of your critique.

Heh, probably true! :laughing:

So, what did I make it? It’s certainly a weak finale, more so due to the episodes that preceded it. The Mirrorverse epic was superb stuff.

To give it due credit, it did recover well from its major mishaps but those mishaps left a bad taste in my mouth. Given how this series has depicted the Klingons, they ain’t going to simply cave to a detonator threat, quite a few would be going: Hit it if you have the balls - or whatever genitals Kilingon males have. Then there’s the fact that it’s serial rapist and torturer L’Rell being rewarded for being a total bastard. And then there is Mirror Georgiou playing everyone for foils, with a complicit Sarek and the dodgiest Starfleet Admiral ever, which is saying something. That combination really cast a pall over Burnham’s concluding speech. It did recover very well, especially with the last scene.

Yep. I read Desperate Hours over the weekend - it’s pretty good, which isn’t a surprise as Mack’s a pretty reliable writer, but one thing it really shows up are Burnham’s flaws and her lack of awareness of them. Does Burnham owe her promotion to Georgiou’s patronage? Pretty much, as Saru does have a good case for being promoted but gets turned down. Then there’s how we see Burnham at the start of the series and here, she’s subscribing to the school that says the leader must be ahead of everyone else and isn’t good at cultivating the confidence of the team she leads.

Agreed, I enjoyed Vaughan as a character in the DS9 relaunch a lot.


#1782

They do don’t they? I know I get it in Malaysia the same time as the UK.
It’s only the CBS broadcast in US and Canada I think that goes out first.

The end was a little underwhelming plot-wise but the character moments were great. The end surprised me as with his name in the opening credits I assumed the person hailing would be Jason Isaacs.

My mother in law was sat nearby, not watching but perked up when Georgiou mentioned Malaysia and Langkawi Island. Pretty sure the script writers got that from Michelle Yeoh. It’s about 3 hours on a ferry from where I am.

I read that she pulled an ‘Anthony Hopkins’ and told the producers she only wanted to do the part in her own accent after years of playing characters from pretty much everywhere else.


#1783

Not here no, it never came out before Monday 2 or 3am here… which was like I dunno, around 5 or more hours after people here watched it already.

Ah wait, but maybe people watched it on CBS =P

I don’t know, at what time did it pop-up in Netflix for US peeps?