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Star Trek: Discovery - discussing S01E15, "Will You Take My Hand?"


The series has been pushed to May, and will no longer be the first original show on CBS All Access, with The Good Wife spin-off starting in February.


Obviously, I want these guys to take the time to get this right - but I’m a bit gutted by this delay, not going to lie. That was going to get me thru January depression.


It’s like waiting a little longer for a new Millar/Hitch combo.
If this comes out as a great show then I’m happy to wait, but it does sting a little right now.


I’m disappointed but I’m not greatly surprised. We hadn’t heard any casting announcements or anything along that line as yet. [quote=“KandorLives, post:469, topic:195, full:true”]
It’s like waiting a little longer for a new Millar/Hith combo.
If this comes out as a great show then I’m happy to wait, but it does sting a little right now.

Exactly, if it is great, no one will remember the delay in a couple of years time.


TOS - The Best
TNG - Overrated and badly dated, but some of the best episodes too
DS9 - Hated some of the characters so much I stopped watching around season 3. Will rewatch all of it one day
Voyager - Good cast, some good ideas, but probably home to some of the very worst episodes and so so disappointingly SAFE.
Enterprise - The first 2 seasons are some of the most boring TV I’ve ever watched. The 3rd season is fantastic, the 4th almost as good. I think it deserved more. Terrible final episode.

Fan Stuff

Star Trek Continues - absolutely amazing TOS era stuff. I will be saddened if the new guidelines kill it.
Horizon - pretty amazing for the budget, not a bad story, but the usual broad range of acting ability, shall we say :slight_smile:
Renegades - Honestly thought this was pretty mediocre given the talent involved.
Of Gods and Men - actually not that bad, but a bit sappy in places.

I haven’t seen much of Star Trek New Voyages/Phase 2, but it looks a notch below STC

Star Trek - a Tale of Two Cities. The porn parody with all the sex cut out. You can have fun guessing where all the cuts are. Also stars a surprisingly decent Picard :slight_smile:


Now might be a good time to draw your attention to our rolling Star Trek watching thread.

It’s sort of like a book club, except we watch an episode of Star Trek every couple of weeks.

I haven’t seen Star Trek Continues at all. I need to check that out.

I really liked Horizon, despite not having seen any of Enterprise. I thought that it was a fairly solid, fairly polished movie (notwithstanding some of the acting).

Renegades - It is wildly inconsistent. There are some parts that are great and some which are terrible. It needed a lighter touch, rather than “Everything and the kitchen sink” approach.

I have watched a few episodes of New Voyages. There is some dodgy acting, but the episodes that I saw were pretty good. Check out The Mind Sifter.


Seasons 4 onwards are outstanding, you should definitely re-watch!! We’re currently checking out the DS9 episode Far Beyond The Stars in this thread. Join in :grinning:

Star Trekkin' Across the Universe: Discussing The Porgs


Yeah, January always seemed a bit soon, and especially so with American Gods not even out yet. I’d rather they take a bit more time and make it the best they can.


Yeah. I think that we would all prefer that they do something worthwhile. Much as I enjoy the reboot movies (and I really, really like Star Trek Beyond), they are action adventure movies using the aesthetic of Star Trek. Trying to reinvent the sort of thing that Star Trek did for a modern audience and modern sensibility (and not just to appeal to Trekkies), is going to take time.


Very much so. Luckily, I think the actual sci-fi (as opposed to space action adventure) aspect of Star Trek probably lends itself better to the TV format than to movies, anyway. I still think making it a prequel show will hamper the reinvention aspect of it, but, well, what can you do.

Seems like Fuller’s comments above indicate they’ll go political. State of the world right now, picking up on the original show’s Cold War vibes does seem like a logical way to go.


I think Star Trek works best as a TV conceit where they can properly get into ideas and character. I have to admit to not to being a terribly knowledgeable Star Trek fan and am enjoying the rewatches we are doing in the Star Trekkin thread. I am getting to watch and appreciate stuff that passed me by.

Despite the show being a prequel, I would hope that they don’t get too precious about it and let them doing their own thing. If they’re trying to match up with a show made 50 years in terms of style and structure, it probably won’t work so well. People expect a lot more complexity from their characters now.


What are people’s favourite Star Trek shows/movies?

I’d have to rank them as:

1/ The Next Generation - it might just be nostalgia but this was the one I grew up with, watching those dreadful early episodes on a tiny, black-and-white portable telly in my grandparent’s spare room (the later seasons do hold up really well).

2/ Original Series - all these decades later and it is still the most iconic

3/ Deep Space Nine - a solid show once it got into the swing of things in the later years but I don’t love it as much as some do

4/ Enterprise - seasons three and four deserve better than the general apathy surrounding the show (well, not the series finale episode)

5/ Voyager - Neelix.

Never seen The Animated Series.


1/ The Wrath of Khan - the 1982 version, not the 2002 or 2013 versions. No doubt there will be some contrarians but surely this is one movie franchise with a unanimous choice for the best film in it?

2/ The Undiscovered Country - Nicholas Meyer again delivers the goods

3/ The Voyage Home - sheer fun; crazy to think there was a time when a major sci-fi movie franchise could put out a light-hearted comedy

4/ First Contact - would work a lot better as a generic sci-fi action flick than as a Star Trek film given the wonky treatment of some characters, especially Picard, but it is still a rollicking good time

5/ The Search for Spock - the weakest link of the ‘trilogy’ between the second/third/fourth movies but still worth it for the charisma of that original crew

6/ The Final Frontier - a mess, to be sure, but at least a well-intended one with some ambitions

7/ Star Trek - as with a lot of JJ Abrams work, it was fun at the time but gets more irritating the more I think about it

8/ Generations - pretty dull and plodding but, hey, look kids, it’s a Kirk/Picard team-up!

9/ Insurrection - just pretty dull and plodding

10/ Nemesis - it is a fine line between this and the next one but this gets slight bonus marks for Picard’s Top Gear moment and the sheer balls on display for not even attempting to explain Worf’s presence

11/ Into Darkness - the Neelix of the movie installments, largely because it squandered a lot of potential and decent set-up just to go back to 1982 again. People have the internet now, JJ. They can just watch Khan if they want to.

Still haven’t seen The Motion Picture or Beyond.


i dunno if I can rate the movies, I’ve only seen most of them once or twice, but I could generally rate them. I’ll preface this list by saying that there’s no Star Trek that I dislike (although TOS is slow as shit on modern day watch) this is just a list based on varying levels of goodness.

1 DS9
The pinnacle of Trek for me. Great concept. Great location and the best characters. I love the early epsiodes and I’ve probably seen most of them about half a dozen times each, minimum.

The next best group of characters and a pretty important show during impressionable years of my life. I have really fond memories of lying on the carpet in front of the TV on a weds night watching these with my step dad. I vividly remember the night that the first episode aired on BBC 2.

3 Enterprise
Yep. That’s right. Enterprise. I’m baffled by the dislike for this series. I love how there was great standalone epsiodes early on then it branched out into big arcs late on. Scott Bakula was a brilliant captain and the rest of the crew were very watchable. Very fond of this show.

4 Voyager
Hard going at times and the crew I like least but it was an interesting new concept and I’m looking forward to eventually getting to it on my currently reach

Brilliant characters that I’m very fond of but when watching nowadays most epsiodes take me about 4 or 5 goes to get thru. So long and pedestrian. I love these guys but it’s taking some effort on my part to rewatch them. The movies benefit from being a bit less meandering.

6 The current movies
Not seen Beyond yet, for no other reason than my kids are young and it’s very difficult to get to the cinema, something I used to do at least once a week.
I like the other two movies a lot, I like the actors who play our beloved character, but it still feels like they are ‘acting’ in the roles that Shatner, Nimoy et al ‘owned’.


Okay. This is a tough one. Regarding the series, I will have to say that I haven’t seen Voyager at all and haven’t watched a lot of Enterprise. They came along at a time when I wasn’t watching Trek and I’ve never bothered to catch up.

So for my favourite TV shows, I would have to say -

1/ The Original Series - The wellspring from which all Star Trek comes. People going from place to place, and weird things happen along the way. I love it in all of it’s primary coloured psychedelic glory. It isn’t constrained by continuity. In one episode, Spock is a Vulcanian, in another he’s a Vulcan. I love the little noises throughout the ship. But mostly, it is Shatner as Kirk. Impetuous, reckless, he manages to explore space and do it in style. Extra points for being the first Trek I saw when I was a small child.

2/ The Next Generation - This was on TV when I was a teenager. In that respect, it should be my favourite. I have great affection for the characters and I watched it religiously when in was on TV (around tea time on a Saturday on RTE 1 if I recall). I remember the agony of waiting for the Best of Both Worlds Cliffhanger to be resolved. I remember successfull arranging Best Man duties around watching All Good Things. But I think that the has dated even more poorly than TOS. Whereas the original Enterprise was full of bright colours and flashy lights, Enterprise D is just so soothing and beige. And everyone on the crew is so reasonable and PC. In any case, I realise that there are probably more classic episodes of TNG than the TOS, so if it is second it is a very close second.

3/ Deep Space Nine - My Trek knowledge is a bit sketchy after TNG finished up. I hadn’t watched much DS9. I saw the pilot. I saw The Way of the Warrior. I think that I was far too enamoured with Babylon 5 at the time and went off Trek. A friend of mine got me into watching it recently. So I’ve seen Seasons 6 and 7 and episodes here and there. I was trying to think of an analogy for DS9. If Star Trek is “Wagon Train to the Stars”, is DS9 Bonanza or Gunsmoke or something like that? I like that the characters have to live with the consequences of their actions in a way that the Enterprise crews didn’t really have to. Also, you can see that the showrunners foresaw a change in how TV was being done, with longer story arcs and callbacks to earlier episodes. And Sisko has to deal with challenges the likes of which Kirk and Picard never did.


  1. Wrath of Khan - Still think that this is one of the great movies about Middle age. Shatner’s best ever performance on screen.
  2. First Contact - Star Trek with the breaks off. It was a shame that they weren’t able to get Tom Hanks for Zefrem Cochrane.
  3. Star Trek Beyond - I really enjoyed it. It isn’t deep, but it is a lot of fun and has the crew visiting a new planet. It embraces the idea of smart people working together.
  4. The Voyage Home - The Nuclear Wessels scene. It’s a classic.
  5. The Undiscovered Country
  6. Star Trek (full of plot holes, but still fun)
  7. The Search for Spock

And the other ones which I don’t like that much, but don’t want to trash (in no particular order)

  • Into Darkness - A bad remake of Wrath of Khan with a bit of DS9 thrown in.
  • Nemesis - I don’t really remember at all. I know I’ve seen it, but I seem to have blocked it out.
  • Insurrection - Ditto.
  • Generations- Doesn’t really work as a movie. It assumes too much foreknowledge of the characters and the situation from the audience. It assumes that anyone watching it will have seen the TV series. As such, it doesn’t stand alone.
  • The Final Frontier - "Why does God need a Starship? " and “I need my pain”. Was there ever a moment so Shatnerian?
  • The Motion Picture - Looks great…I tried watching it recently. Gave up after a half hour.


Top Tier-

TOS, Next Generation, Deep Space Nine
Wrath of Khan, Search for Spock / Voyage Home, Undiscovered Country, First Contact

Standard Fare -

Everything else, except

Starvation Diet -

I have tried and tried, but there is a feeling of despair so prevalent it’s like a fog, and the characters mostly clunk along with no hope of change. Prison Break and Orange Is the New Black contain much more freedom and hope.


Nothing definitive, but:

Hoffman hosts the official Star Trek podcast, so his sources are probably good.


Bryan Fuller is stepping back from the showrunner role of CBS’ “Star Trek: Discovery” as he juggles production responsibilities on two other series, Variety has learned exclusively.

The decision was made late last week to hand the day-to-day showrunning reins to “Star Trek” exec producers Gretchen Berg and Aaron Harberts as “Discovery” gears up for the start of filming next month and a May premiere date. Fuller, who will remain an executive producer, will still be involved in breaking stories, and the show will continue to follow his vision for the universe that this latest “Trek” series will inhabit. Writer-director Akiva Goldsman is also expected to join “Discovery” in a top creative role. He’s envisioned as serving as producing support for Berg and Harberts, Fuller and exec producer Alex Kurtzman as they juggle the demands of the series that CBS is counting on to be the marquee selling point for subscriptions to its CBS All Access SVOD service.

Sources said there had been some strain between “Star Trek” producer CBS Television Studios and Fuller over the progress of production on the show, as Fuller is also juggling the final weeks of shooting and post-production duties on Starz’s upcoming drama “American Gods” and prepping a reboot of “Amazing Stories” for NBC. Fuller has penned the first two scripts for “Discovery” and has hammered out the broader story arc and mythology for the new “Trek” realm. But it became clear that he couldn’t devote the amount of time needed for “Discovery” to make its premiere date and with production scheduled to start in Toronto next month. In September, CBS pushed the “Discovery” premiere back from January in order to give the team more time to work out stories and ensure sufficient time for production of visual effects.

Berg and Harberts are close with Fuller, having worked with him previously on ABC’s “Pushing Daisies.” Goldsman, a feature vet who was also a consulting producer on Fox’s “Fringe” with Kurtzman, is also close with Fuller. The new structure was worked out quickly over the weekend in an effort to allow Fuller to remain actively involved albeit not on the day-to-day production level as originally envisioned. There’s also some internal stress at the studio that the lead character, described by Fuller as a female lieutenant commander, has yet to be cast.




To fair to the studio, if I handed someone the task of resurrecting Star Trek on TV I’d expect them to give it their undivided attention.


But also; they knew what his schedule was when they hired him.

I think everyone went in with slightly too rosy coloured glasses on and now they’ve seen the reality of the time everything takes to get done.

It sounds like everyone wants to make this work, but I think that the casting is probably the biggest sticking point? That person is going to be the face of the series, so it’s a hell of a job making that decision.