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Rate the MCU: 19: Avengers Infinity War

On a scale of 1 (awful) - 5 (amazing) how would you rate Avengers Infinity War?

Avengers Infinity War poster.jpg

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I gave it a 4. Good, but it tried to do a lot. Thanos was the best part.

Thanos was the lead character which was quite brave.

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Thanos was set up as a bit too much of deux ex bad guy for my taste. Everybody has vulnerability. Teaming up against him should have worked when he was without his Obsidian side-kicks. Thor and Hulk should have gone for the head. Hell, Thor should have gone for the head! What was he thinking? Quill I would have locked in a closet with Drax. The great big grinding wheel-things in Wakanda were downright scary. Good movie.

I feel like this is one of those bits of received wisdom about the film that isn’t really true. He’s maybe a bit more fleshed out than a lot of villains, but I don’t feel that he’s more the ‘viewpoint’ lead of the film than the heroes are.

The plot revolves around him, but no more so than, say, Darth Vader in ESB.

I think it’s a movie where there isn’t really a single lead, by its nature it’s a big ensemble movie with lots of different groups of characters chopping and changing between them. I think that, more than anything, is probably what made it feel like Thanos is on a more equal footing with the heroes.

That and the fact that he wins at the end. :slight_smile:

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You can think that. :wink:

I’d respectfully disagree, all my wisdom comes naturally. He’s as much a lead as anyone else at the least.

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Sorry, I didn’t mean that as a dig - just that it’s something I’ve heard a lot about the film but I’ve always been a bit unsure of.

This is it, I think, and what I was getting at in the last part of my post. There isn’t a single main focus character, so he feels like he gets as much attention as any other single hero does.

4/5
Lot of good stuff but damn there’s some boring shite in it, not even the streets of edinburgh can salvage that Wanda and Vision crap

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I think it’s a bit more than that. With Thanos, there’s a point when he’s taken over Gamorra and all of the heroes are well on their way, when his story takes over for a bit. There are flashbacks to his and Gamora’s shared past, he discusses his motivation for her and states his goal of hanging up his armor and going home. And then, we move on to the challenge he has to overcome to get the soul stone. And in overcoming that challenge, he loses what he loves most in the universe. That part of the movie is his journey, and it’s why it has such an impact when the last scene of the movie belongs to him.

It’s because of those scenes that you can read the movie as Thanos’ story. I don’t think we had anything like it with Vader.

Oh, solid 4/5. Some truly great bits, some that dragged somewhat.

ESB is partly about Vader’s obsession with tracking down Luke, you have his relationship with the Emperor, his destructive approach to his own men in pursuit of what he wants, the reveal of his ugliness under the helmet, his machinations with Boba and Lando, and then of course the big final act where his relationship with Luke is fully revealed in a way that’s more than just an empty twist because of the way the movie has built towards it.

Him revealing Luke to be his son and his desire to join with him and overthrow the Emperor is a huge character moment - we’ll see if the Gamorra scenes from Infinity War still have the cultural impact of Vader and Luke in 40 years. :slight_smile:

Like with Thanos, though, I still don’t think that makes him the protagonist of the movie - just a baddie who’s a lot more developed and interesting than usual.

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You have to do a fair bit of extrapolating to get there though - most of what you’re describing are actually just villain scenes designed to make him seem terrifying (or plot setup for the further story, with the Emperor), or the kind of scenes that let us know that the next threat to the good guys is. Compared to Thanos, Vader is seriously underdeveloped - until the end of the movie, we don’t find out what he wants (apart from finding Luke) or how he got to this point in his life.* Infinity War gives us all that for Thanos, and that’s not something you normally do for villains, at least not with larger sections of the movie devoted to it.

The only thing that stands out with Vader is revealing he is Luke’s father and the offer he makes him; that is a truly amazing twist and Thanos will never ever have the cultural impact of “I am you father”.

*And they never do make that story work, do they? Not even after devoting another trilogy of movies to it.

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Yes. Remember I’m arguing that both Vader and Thanos are not fully-fledged protagonists of their movies, just well-developed villains.

I think really we’re now just debating which is the better-developed villain, not whether Thanos can be considered the protagonist of Infinity War.

Thanos maybe has the edge there (possibly because he had more time for scenes about him in a three-hour movie), although I have to say that despite having seen Infinity War twice I still don’t really have a strong sense of exactly why Thanos is motivated to achieve the cosmic balance he’s so obsessed with. Maybe I’m forgetting something significant there though.

And I am pointing out that there are some clear differences there - Thanos has a lot of moments that are devoted only to developing his character and showing his journey, whereas Vader’s moment are all pretty typical Let’s-see-what-the-villain-is-up-to scenes.

His home planet was destroyed because they didn’t heed his warnings about resources running out. He’s basically Jor El.

Well, I think you have to see that one a bit tongue-in-cheek. There are moments when his story takes over the movie - the whole Soul Stone sequence is pretty much told from his point of view - and they actually need that to make the movie cohesive at a point when the other heroes are well on their way to Thanos and there isn’t much left to do plot-wise. And they clearly refer to that by giving Thanos the happy ending of the movie and with the “Thanos will return.” line at the end. Structurally, all of that is unusual and a brave choice, and Thanos also is the character in the movie that gets the biggest emotional moments, I would say.

But there are obviously also a lot of moments to counter that idea - the whole first half of the movie, for one. So, yeah, it’s not as easy as saying he’s the protagonist of the movie. But he is more so than you would expect, and maybe as much as any of the characters. And that opens up an ambiguity that allows you to read the movie as him being the protagonist, which is fun - and intentionally so, I think. You can see all of that in how this bit is staged, for example:

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I think this sums it up nicely. :slight_smile:

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