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Legion: The Marvel TV Series (SPOILERS)


#21

Yeah - that could be it.

I’m more inclined to believe that some parts of the world we see are real, but we’ll see.


#22

I’d like that too, but with Legion being brought into the mainstream it would work as an end of season twist.

I like the leveled psyche theory the best. Each setting, change of clothes, and cast being of their own and his disorientation coming from phasing through them.


#23

I think that’s a touch way to tell the story - it removes his agency really. There needs to be a legitimate threat beyond just going insane.


#24

I think that folds nicely with the Devil with the Yellow Eyes/the Mojo-looking guy (if they are the same or different characters at this point).

Much like with Fight Club, when you personify a mental illness, it becomes a legitimate threat.


#25

Yeah, but Fight Club, importantly took place in the real physical world.

If we’re saying that the entire narrative is happening solely in David’s mind and it’s all symbolic of his conflicting personalities, thoughts, and fears, then we’ve got no touchstone to the real-world to see how that might play out in a real-world sense; ergo, we must have, or at least, must soon, see some of David in the real world to understand the external implications of his mental illness.

I think we’ve definitely seen some of the real-world - but how much is hard to say.


#26

I’m willing to concede that yeah.

Perhaps the real world is with his sister.
And we see how the actions within affect his family, making that a cornerstone for the audience.


#27

Wow that was amazing. The production, the action, the acting, the music… Fuuuuck, that was better than any X-Men movie to this date as far as I’m concerned (except DP, of course =P)

As for the story, well who the hell knows… it felt like watching an even trippier Mr Robot episode, but it grabbed me nice and tight. From what little I know about Legion, sure, maybe it’s all in his head and every other mutant we saw might’ve been just a manifestation of his powers, buuuut… 1) I hope not, 'cause some of those characters were pretty cool and 2) This is supposedly at least tied to the X-movies, and they didn’t beat around the “mutant” thing… So at the very least I do hope the military organization was real, and they are indeed chasing mutants… I could live with Sidney & co. being David’s split powers, but I’m hoping something was actually real in all that glorious mess.

Anyways, that hooked me up good, really excited to see what’s next. I’m sooo glad that we’re getting so many awesome TV shows with almost movie quality these days… I mean, granted, I don’t like Walking Dead, but I remember S1 was super well done… plus the Netflix shows, and Preacher on AMC. We’re getting pretty spoiled here :smile:

The only bad thing is that this show, once more, puts the regular network dreck to utter and complete shame… I mean how am I supposed to watch AoS after that? =P

*Edit: Oh and the photography was wonderful… that’s what I enjoy the most from these smaller big-budget series… they usually kill it. This Hawley guy is probably gonna get snatched by Hollywood pretty soon =P


#28

Yeah I was saying that to Lorcan. That I think a rewatch at the end will result in a lot of OMG moments.

I enjoyed it. But I do think knowing about the character beforehand is a benifit.

Aoife was put off by the headplay aspect! Her only encounter with Legion before this was when she read the AOA books! And he’s just at the begining and the end. So she isn’t familiar with his Pysch issues.
When she compared him to Storm I knew the show was losing her.
That was around the 35 minute mark.
Hopefully she enjoys the next one a little more.

Solid first episode. Personally thought Legion was an obscure character to run with as a showr front.
But it feels like a labour of love. Almost as pretty as "Pushing Daisy’s"
It also reminds me of The Prisoner in its headmess ways.

While I love that idea and would love to see it happen. I think that we need to know about David in RL for that to have the desired emotional effect.
So maybe season 2 or 3. :slight_smile:
There’s definitely aspect to the episode that are in his head. The hard part is choosing which parts.

And while I see “superhero” show being used. I don’t see Legion as a superhero character.
Interesting yes. But seldom a hero. He’s mostly about saving/fixing himself!


#29

I agree with most of this - a very striking show; sadly there will likely be a dip over the next four episodes at least with Hawley no longer directing.


#30

I did not take to it very strongly. It didn’t really tell much of a story in this episode and was more than a little confusing. At the end, I was reminded a bit of the opening of The Magicians where a character asks someone if they are a hallucination and they answer, “if I was, how would my answer help you?”

Too much is unclear especially with the people who apparently captured David. Do they want David or do they want the girl? They start out saying that he may be the most powerful mutant they’ve encountered, but based on what evidence? They just picked him up at that point. They hadn’t seen him do anything. It seems like they think Syd Barrett (named after Pink Floyd?) is the mutant they want and the fact they are willing to kill David to find her sort of confirms that, but, at the same time, why would they think he knows where she is? They’d have to be dumb not to get that since he’s looking for her, too, he doesn’t know where she is.

And then, of course, there’s the “is all this in his head” question that confounds whatever happens in the story. It was very messy way to present an interesting concept.

The essential idea in itself is pretty interesting. Is David a sane man responding rationally to his mutant powers? In other words, since the only rational explanation for what he can do is that he’s insane, is he actually very rational in thinking that he must be insane? Or is he really insane on top of having these powers?

The latter seems more likely and that in itself is compelling enough that they don’t need to tell the story in such a messy way. I would compare it to The Magicians in that sense as the main character there also suffers mental illness (not as severe) and discovers that the fact he can do magic doesn’t really solve the problems he has.


#31

Well they might be looking for powerful mutants to restrain/use/experiment/kill them… who knows… But they had David already, so they were just trying to find out where was the girl to pick her up before they killed him. That wasn’t too confusing, tbh. Probably the least confusing part of the whole episode :smile:

Unless it was all in his head of course… But I don’t think so.


#32

Still, you can see why he would think that because none of it really made sense except in a very cliched, and frankly dumb, way.

That’s the trajectory of the whole episode though. From original to cliche to stupidly cliched. It starts in an interesting place. Mutant powers and mental illness as integrated metaphors for the alienation one feels from adolescence to young adulthood.

For me, that’s a great basis for an interesting dramatic series. A man who is sane until gifts that set him drastically apart from others convinces him that he’s insane and then when he realizes that these are gifts, he’s already traumatized to the point that he actually is insane and now has to find a way to cope. To achieve balance. That’s a terrific dramatic premise.

Sure, you have to throw in the secret organizations and eccentric resistance groups, but the “evil” organization started out much more interesting. Like they could actually turn out to be more interested in helping David than Syd’s team would be.

But then, they turn out to be typical Bond villains with low rent Mission Impossible death traps.

I was still interested when he was in Clockworks even though it was also pretty much a cliche and, obviously, the most well designed and comfortable mental health facility ever on television. I mean, he was much better off there than his sister’s basement. Nevertheless, it felt like a Cuckoo’s Nest with a Scanners twist storyline was in the offing.

But then that is blown away and they instead go for the evil secret organization angle which ends up with David again drifting into a completely new environment with whatever that Miss Peregrine style group turns out to be.

David actually doesn’t take action as much as he is acted upon. The story progressed from something interesting to something confused but oddly familiar. I actually didn’t feel that the episode really told a story. It barely introduced the main characters.


#33

This show has a lot of potential but damn… it’s trying way to hard too be quirky and different.

One of things that bugs me about this, and ‘High Rise’ last year, is that they’re so carried away with the stylistic ticks of a bygone era that they let it overwhelm the narrative and characters in a way that the people (back in the day) would never have wanted it to.

When Kubrick or Roeg or Furie were making movies this was the absolute, contemporary, cutting age style. They weren’t copying it, they were inventing it!

When someone in the present dips into that bag of tricks thats often, unfortunately, exactly what these things end up being; tricks. Self conscicous and very, very noticeable.

There’s a lot to love here and I’ll stick with it, but I wish they’d toned down the homage-ness.


#34

It’s noticeable but that’s what I love about it. It’s a rare show that fills every scene with something of interest. It wasn’t workmanlike - no extended part of it was workmanlike, so even something boring happening happened in an interesting way.

Similar to how good comics art can make the mundane seem exciting by playing with silhouettes or odd angles or breaking panel borders or interesting panel shapes and page layouts.

(Which is all fitting considering the prominent credit at the end - one Bill Sienkiewicz.)


#35

It’s personal taste again, to me, trying to make a boring scene interesting with fancy lighting, art direction and camera angles is a poor substitute for making the scene itself interesting.

It’s like putting lipstick on a pig.

And I’m not David Cameron.


#36

Well the thing is, though, we don’t know exactly how much is “real” and how much isn’t, so I don’t think we can say this or that is cliched at this point. There’s a case to be made that the people who rescue him are all Legion, but that might be also true about the “bad” guys… It could just be a case of some of his personalities clashing between them, all inside his mind, or something like that. I mean, at this point the show could go anywhere basically.

I am hoping that some of the things we saw were “real” because I’d hate for it to be a “it was all in his head” sort of thing, which I find to be super lame. In the end, the show is supposed to be part of the Fox X-verse, so having a military org. chasing mutants would be, not cliché, but pretty standard. But again, who knows… I think we’ll need a couple more episodes before being able te establish what is and what isn’t.


#37

I did spend the episode waiting for any of the “powers” name’s I’m familiar with to pop up.

Also need to see The hair make an appearance. He needs the hair.


#38

That sentence has sold me on it… The Prisoner is my favourite TV show.


#39

I liked it. in the Hawley interview, I found a couple of interesting points. The Music was great and this point was so cool

Hawley: It’s a very distinctive musical sound. I told the composer a couple years ago that it should sound like Dark Side of the Moon. And he went out and got those patch-cord synthesizers from that album. So much is created in that mix of sound and image, and the mood that it creates.

they want both. a mutant who can switch bodies would make a great spy or assassin.

TVLINE | OK, some quick practical questions: Was the mental hospital connected to the government agency interrogating David?
No, they’re separate. It’s not until he uses his powers in a big way — or Syd does, when she’s transferred over — that he does something loud enough for them to hear. And then they come to get him, and they end up with her.


#40

That’s the problem, though. They DON’T end up with her. They end up looking for her and find him because he’s looking for her too. He just pops up and they grab him when they want her.

The confusion is that they would think she was responsible for the impossible thing that happened at the institution so that’s why they want her.

This seems to be confirmed because they are willing to kill him to get her - even though, again, they are stupid to think that he would know where she is based on everything they’ve learned so far. The only reason they got him was that he was looking for her. If he’s looking for her, then he doesn’t know where she is!

Hell, how do they even know if it would kill him? They haven’t done anything significant to figure out what he can do.

Personally, I get the impression that the writers didn’t really think very deeply about whatever story they were telling because, like Steve points out, they were much more interested in the style of the show rather than the content.

Which is understandable in television because they are on a deadline to deliver. But it didn’t encourage me to watch it. Right now, I have no idea what show I’m watching and, essentially, that’s what gets me to invest in a series.