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Game of Thrones - the TV show (Spoilers for the TV show)


Whaaaaat? That’s stupid… =/

GoT is one of the shows with the most diversity in recent years, except in the asian dptm, which is rather normal for this type of story. Maybe he meant there’s not enough black people for his taste? eh…


How’s it diverse? They’re all white except 2 slaves, a pirate and a con man.


Right, so you missed all the Dorne characters, and all the Dothraki plus a lot of the people in Essos we’ve seen since season 1? Or is a whole continent of non-white folk somehow not enough? :smile:


Yeah, it’s hard to say there’s been whitewashing in Essos.

Only a portion of the story takes place there though.


Fairly large one though, much too my dismay, since I’ve not been a fan of the whole Danny side of the story.


It must be said that there is no major black character in the story.


True but there aren’t a lot of black characters in the show… it’s mostly whites and some sort of arab/indian-like races. The Dothraki are probably mongolian type as well.


That might be the point.


Oyelowo’s comments are well reasoned;

The fact that they put any ethnic minorities in that means that there should be space for bigger characters. Because you’re not just saying ‘OK this is purely a white world, and here are very story-driven reasons why that’s the case…You are interspersing people of colour into it. And so therefore it’s a conscious decision to put them on the margins, as opposed to put them front and centre. Even if for whatever reason, it’s a world in which people of colour in those stories are subservient, or they are more in a helper role, that doesn’t mean they can’t have prominent storylines. All you have to do is shift the focus to focus on those characters.

The conscious part is where it get’s sticky; who decides which characters to promote and why?

It’s a deliberately medieval european world, with side trips to other areas with other people.

So would more Grey Worm and Missandei have been a good idea?


It sounds rather difficult to do, though. I mean, I haven’t read the novels, but there’s so much going on that it’s hard to imagine giving those characters much more space. The Starks and the Lannisters still have to be at the center of things, after all.


Grey Worm and Missandei are barely in the books, and they don’t have a subplot of their own.

People of colour are incredibly rare in Westeros according to the literal text of the books - there’s only one black man at court in King’s Landing, for example.


I suspected as much.

George RR Martin could’ve introduced a major black character living in Westeros - that wouldn’t even have been all that hard to believe even in the Middle Ages in some ways, I mean, look at Othello. But he didn’t, and this would’ve been a major change for the show to make.

(Damn. Now I’m imagining Idris Elba in Westeros, and how great that would’ve been!)


Yeah, especially as modern history acknowledges that the racial mix in Europe was more diverse than we assumed in the past.


The reason I asked specifically about Grey Worm and Missandei is because they’re already significant, she’s right next to Dany all the time and he’s running her army, plus they have their own relationship.

Would giving them more screen time be a good idea?

My own answer is; if it serves the story, but that’s because plot matters to me. So should we see more of Missandei dealing with Dany’s problems as queen? Should we have more of Grey Worm tackling security and strategy for her? It’s not like the show doesn’t run on court intrigue a lot of the time.

I’m playing devil’s advocate a bit because i like show enough the way it is, but we are watching an adapted story which has taken a lot of liberties with the novels. More change was possible, if those paths had been chosen.


I’d watch an entire series just of Missandei, doing anything.


Well I like both characters so I wouldn’t necessarily mind as long as they were good scenes with a purpose, which might be the tricky part in a series that’s already dealing with A LOT of characters and plots and subplots.

Anyways, the article is stupid AF and I would say the exact same thing about an article complaining about the lack of “important” white characters or asians or whatever in Luke Cage.


More seriously the Lord of the Rings concept came from Tolkien saying he wanted to create British myths to the level of the Norse or Greek ones (and there are some like the Mabinogi and Beowulf but never quite got the same traction).

From then on people have worked from that template and expanded it but generally kept to it and a very northern European perspective. Martin is far from the worst and expanded into a metaphorical African continent with Essos but equally nobody gives a shit about it. Which doesn’t always make much sense, I mean Meereene looks a considerably more impressive place than Winterfell or anywhere in Westeros outside King’s Landing.

It’s like ‘fuck Dubai, let’s take control of Hull’.


That’s hardly the same thing though.


How so?


Because calling for more representation of a minority that is underrepresented isn’t the same thing as calling for more representation of a majority that is overrepresented.

Doesn’t change that it doesn’t make any sense for Game of Thrones for story reasons, in my view, as far as the TV series is concerned. But the general matter? Vastly different thing.