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Game of Thrones - the TV show (Spoilers for the TV show)


I don’t think everyone dies, but with that army and all the wars before I can see lots of people dying. The nation is in ruins. I think Kings Landing is done for too, the Ice Dragon doing what Dany wouldn’t. Before we’re done I think we’ll be in Walking Dead territory.

The Walkers seem to have a purpose - after 8,000 years they rise. Maybe reset society until they think something just has been created instead. Maybe that’s their real purpose, and why they went after the children of the forest. I think the Ice King wants much more than simple genocide.

Bran knows, and I think that’s why he is what he is - to tell the reader the backstory and talk us through what happens after the story ends.


Yeah I can see that. I think it’s actually underestimated how much all parties have been savaged already by the war set up at the end of season 1. Dany built her’s from nothing but everyone else has just taken loss after loss after loss to their numbers. Even if they won some battles their strength diminishes each time.


I’m glad you’ve been keeping that spreadsheet of cast members’ heights, Gar. :smiley:


I’ll be honest, I read a clickbait story about it just yesterday. I can even recall more.

Tyrion is the shortest of course at 4’5", then Arya at 5’. Brienne is 6’3" tall, Dany is only 5’2".



Just checkin to see how you stack up, eh?


2 short jokes in a day should be beneath you Mr Kiel.

If not I will move on to hair loss Lord Varys. :smile:


I’m not sure the dragon fire was “fire” in a literal sense. I think there’s more magic in a zombie, ice, wight dragon than even a regular dragon.

I don’t object to it being able to bring down the wall, it just felt like a little bit of a let down after all the build up.

What GoTs used to do was set up a possible solution to a problem, and then pull the rug out from under the audience. The new twists are less like that.

Cersei turning on everyone is that sort of twist, but less twisty because she’s Cersei. Back stabbing is not a surprise from her.

Some insight from the show runners;



Did you notice that conspicuous moment in the Dragonpit where Bronn and Podrick exit stage left for no apparent reason? That may be because Bronn actor Jerome Flynn and Cersei actor Lena Headey are on such infamously bad terms in real life that the production teams make sure they’re “kept apart at all costs.” Filming for the major meeting of Westerosi leadership took several days, and it looks like having Bronn disappear for the majority of them was the solution producers came up with.



I quite liked Littlefinger’s End. Sophie Turner got to make up for a whole lot of clunky Sansa moments, Bran made a quiet show of force, and Arya is just terrific.

It’s the kind of trial I’d like to run for a few politicos right along through now.


Well Cersei’s been on a crazy spiral for a long time, she’s just too stoic (maybe too much in the show) that we’ve seen her as a cunning villain, rather than a bat-shit crazy one, but she’s really there at this point. Now without Jamie she’s gonna go full blown crazy evil in next season. Well she IS the main villain anyways, so it makes sense… However, GoT is about redemption, so we’ll see if she manages to redeem herself before the end.

I was a bit scared for Jamie too, because I was afraid they’d pull a stupid “shocker” stunt just to shock people. However, I’m glad they’re stickin to the main characters’ arcs. Which brings me to the dead/survivor pool… Because now we’ve got the final set-up, and next season a lot of people will die, probbably… I don’t see too many happy endings… so here are my predictions:

Jamie: Let’s start with him… So he’s still got some plot-armour left in him. After all he IS the Kingslayer, so his redemption arc is to both embrace his title but for a good cause, which I still believe means he will either be the one to kill Cersei, or most likely the Night King… No reason why he couldn’t deliver the final blow, useless hand and all. He still has some valarian steel IIRC (Joffrey’s dagger I think). So in the end I’m thinking he will sacrifice himself to take out either the villain king or the villain queen. We’ll see… but I don’t see him surviving the final conflict.

Hound / Mountain: Well, he obviously still has business with the Mountain, although, I’m thinking Arya might play a surprising role in that whole ordeal. He should be safe until his redemption arc is complete as well, but like Jamie, I don’t think he’ll make it out alive… his chances are a lot higher tho =P

Cersei: Obviously she’ll make it to the very end, but she’s gotta die. That’s not really a huge prediction… :smile:

Theon / Yara / Euron: Well he’s had plot-armour since day one, even if he got it rough… but his redemption arc is almost complete… we saw him find his proverbial balls again this last episode, so now he’s ready to tie up his arc. I don’t see him surviving because he’s too damaged for the “new world” they’re bulding towards… Yara seems like a better candidate to usher he people into a new age. Theon doesn’t even want to lead, he wants to atone, so he’s probably gonna bite it. As for Uncle Euron… eh he’s the Joffrey/Ramsey of the final act so yeah, he going down… obviously.

Arya/Sansa: Maybe one of them will die, but I’m not sure which one… I highly doubt they’ll both make it out alive, but hey, who knows… To me, I don’t see Arya surviving because of what she’s become, and Sansa has finally shown the change she needed in roder to fit the new order of things… But then again, it’s always possible Sansa learnt too much from LF and pays the price for it… so it’s very hard to tell right now. There’s a scenario where both will make it.

Gendry: Well he’s the last of the Baratheons and a bastard, so I’m pretty sure he’ll make it and end up marrying one of the Stark girls, possibly Arya if she survives. I think his role is to re-forge the long-standing alliance and friendship between the Baratherons and the Starks.

Bran: We’ll he’s completely tied to the whole WW threat, so while I think he will survive, I don’t think he’ll get a classical “good” ending. I see him having a tragic ending in the end, maybe choosing to retreat back north when all is over to take his place as the new tree man beyond the wall, because well he keeps saying, he’s the 3-eyed raven. Buuut, maybe not… maybe this time they’ll finally break the cycle and his role as the 3-eyed raven will be no more… There’s a scenario where I also see him fulfilling his role and going back to being just Bran. Unlikely tho.

The crazy prince, lord of the Vale whateve’rs his name I forgot… Ugh he’s probably gonna die… he’s too batshit crazy to survive… unless he’s done some serious growing up between seasons, but doubt it :smile:

Varys / Melissandre: Well these 2 are simple, they already spelled it out. They’re gonna bite it, they’re both too tied to the old-ways of politics and religous fanatisicm so they have NO place in the new world. Varys has already fulfilled his purpose, and Melissandre still might have one more act of redemption before she goes, but they’re both marked.

Berric: Well he’s also tied into the whole religious thingie, I think he’s always been desined to fight and die for his lord… Plus he’s already died a lot and lost his ressurection buddy, so, yeah =P

SerFriendzone: Well his whole point has been to sacrifice himself for his Khaleessi sooo… why rob him of that? Probably gonna save Danny from some threat and die. Hey he might get a kiss out of the whole deal… who knows :smile:

Qyburn: Ugh that creepo has got to go, not even worth a prediction…

Poddrick / Sam / Gilly / Brienne / Davos / Bronn /Tormund / Little Lyanna / Grey Worm / Missandei: The uppity sidekicks, all good people at heart if not in manners, they should all be safe… they’re the future of Westeros, and they should all take roles in making sure the ship is steered in the right path, as counselors or even leaders (in the case of Tormund, GW and Missandei maybe).

I’m separating Tyrion from the group above because he’s more important, but pretty much the same deal, plus he’ll be the last Lanister standing. His plot armour is made of adamantium =P

And finally Jon / Danny… Damn, well this is the big one… Who knows. They could both survive, both die or just one of them at this point. There’s a case to be made for each scenario since they’re both Targaryen and both worthy leaders at this point. I really don’t think both will survive, but eh… the show runners might want to get sappy with this one. My momey’s on Jon dying, or getting taken out of the picture somehow, because that’s more him, plus he might get Danny pregnant and since he sould not be Lord of Winterfell anymore pretty soon, I don’t see what’s his place after all this is done. He’s no ruler, he doesn’t want to be… and once the war is won? what’s his purpose? None… so yeah, my money is definetly on him either dying or having a bitter-sweet ending of sorts.

– Edit: Oh and btw, the reason I’m not more sure about some of these anymore is because of the book/series divergences at this point… I haven’t read the books, but it’s VERY possible that things will not go down the same way. Plus, it all will depend on what kind of message or comentary GRRM wants to make with the ending, there are several viable options at this point… BUT there’s also the fact that the showrunners might not go for the same message than the books, both because of the different nature of the books and the show and also to allow Martin the freedom to end his story as he wishes without people getting completely spoiled… so there are waaay too many impossible to predict factors. I was REALLY certain of the ending at some point, because of the direction of the story, but given all the real-life complications, I’d be a fool to stick with them… I’m actually surpsied I’ve been mostly right so far but I’m not gonna push it :smile:


I’d given up hope of it making it into the show. And even though the context is entirely different, I’m glad it showed up at last.

That’s against White Walkers, you need fire or dragonglass against Wights.


I get the feeling that when Qyburn saw the wight, he became very aroused.


Jon sliced that Wight captain right well with Longclaw. He was not using dragonglass at that point. I don’t think.


Back in series 1? They had to use fire to kill the Wights in Castle Black.

Or if you mean last week when he killed one dude that caused all the Wights to crumble? That was a White Walker.


You just know that he kept the severed hand. And we all know why he kept it too


So this was a great conclusion to a middling series. And don’t get me wrong- middling Game of Thrones is still great TV. It’s just that it’s fallen a bit.

Everyone’s been talking about plot twists, but I don’t think they’re essential to the show. It’s about the interpersonal drama between this cast, and how the ramifications of their decisions echo throughout the world by virtue of their position. And the exciting character deaths are the ones where we can see how their choices brought them to that moment.

Take Robb, for example. If you look back at series 3 the choices that lead to his death are laid bare - falling in love with Talisa, Roose Bolton objecting to his decisions and then letting Jamie go free, and then killing Lord Karstark after he murdered their Lannister prisoners. There was a mounting sense of dread over Robb’s life in that series (and the appropriate chapters in the books), and while the event of the Red Wedding may have been a shock, it’s largely because we were told repeatedly that they were safe thanks to the ritual of sharing bread and salt.

Similarly Joffrey’s death was a result of choices - Oleanna’s conversation about him with Sansa was to determine how safe Margery would be as his wife. Joffrey’s own sadism sealed his fate, just as Robb’s selfishness at one point and hidebound nature did at another.

Littlefinger’s death here is exhilarating here for much the same reason. It’s not the twist that Sansa and Arya are working together - it’s that his schemes have finally unravelled. Compare it to the death of Doran Martell a few years ago. Ellaria killed him because, I guess he didn’t avenge his brother’s death quick enough - but she proceded to do fuck all until her capture and prompt vanishing from the show.

This is also why Jamie and Cersei’s confrontation was so powerful. We’ve all been rooting for him to make a stand against her since he got back to King’s Landing way back when. It can be baffling at times as to why it took so long, but his decisions are justifiable. So it’s satisfying when he walks away. And once again we fear for his life because Cersei’s ruthlessness means we’re not sure if she’ll order The Mountain to kill him or not.

It’s these moments that sell the show, that sell these people, and make this story great.

(and just to bring balance to the Force, ask any book reader what they think of Quentyn Martell’s arc in book 5 for a literary equivalent of the problem the show has sometimes)

Speaking of the books, given Jon’s birth name, I assume they’re kinda folding Jon Connington/Young Aegon’s plot into his rather than ignore it completely.


Which is going to totally screw up the Arch-Maester’s outline for A Tedious Telling of the Battles and Whatnot That Occurred Following the Inadvertent Death of Robert Baratheon First of His Name and Stuff the Author Just Went and Made Up.


I think it’s pretty clear that Dany is going to get knocked up by Jon. Maybe it already happened on the boat. That means Dany will live long enough to give birth. Jon, though, he’s free to die if there’s a baby in the mix.