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DC Cinematic Universe - Wonder Woman, Justice League and More


#6366

With hindsight, I think this is a case where going big right out of the gate might have worked out better. Rather than doing a big build-up to Darkseid and the Fourth World, just start a Justice League movie with that. Series of booms all around the world, Parademons flood out, clearing the way for Darkseid, each member of the League is introduced trying to deal with it on their own, then they come together to take on Darkseid. Tease the New Gods by having some of the team captured part way through and Mister Miracle and Big Barda help them escape (and deliver exposition).

It’s probably 85% the first Avengers movie, and works a bit better if you don’t have to spend time resurrecting Superman, but I think if you throw it all on the screen (as Aquaman did) the audience recognizes that.


#6367

I feel like Watchmen and Man Of Steel and Sucker Punch for that matter are difficult to follow at times, visually. I remember Watchmen was playing in the background one night with no sound (it’s the first time I really noticed the problems I find with him) and I was watching thinking I’ve read this story 10 times and I can’t really tell what’s happening scene to scene here some of the time. Im not saying he doesnt manage it at all, but he seems to really forget about the connective parts at times and is inconsistent in thinking about how he’s visually telling the story. I wish I could think of examples right now but it’s an observation I had ages ago and hadn’t thought about it again until recently.


#6368

This is a really odd metric for a film for me, “I want to be able to follow a film when I’m not watching it.” I also don’t just have things on in the background for noise or movement though. I might be the only person in the world who wishes every bar/restaurant didn’t have TV’s on every wall.

When I choose to watch something, I want it to be engaging.


#6369

I love Snyder’s design sense and vision. The initial flying sequence in Man of Steel is incredible. I love bits of all he’s done. Adored the Watchmen trailer, literally fell asleep watching the film.
He has a classic in him I think if he gets the right writing and control. Like Ridley Scott who has the same issue but has often landed on that brilliant story.


#6370

Well that’s part of it for me too, and I think most people. I look at it from the aspect that visuals are the what is happening and dialog is the why. So when a scene in something plays out you should never need to be told what is going on. And ultimately you can have a good film even if you don’t get it right or are inconsistant, it just personally bugs me in action or Superhero movies especially.


#6371

#6372

That’s not my baby- …wait.


#6373

I don’t know about that. I like JL better than I did BvS.

Either way though, it was a tragedy that interrupted his work on the movie and the end result of bringing Whedon in at the point when they did was always going to be a bit of a mess.

We’ve been saying that Snyder is a strong director when he has a good script for ages now, but the problem is that he has great control over the scripts at this point and apparently he doesn’t recognise a shoddy one when it bites him in the ass. I’d be giving up on him if he wasn’t making a zombie Netflix movie next, which might well be exactly the right move.

Meanwhile, let’s see some James Gunn in the DC universe. And unlike Steve, I could also see him on Superman.


#6374

That’s a false narrative… by the time he “stepped down” he’d already completed a whole movie, in terms of principal photography at least (obviously VFX and all the post-stuff was not completed). If they really only wanted to finish it, it would’ve been a different product. No, they brought Whedon to change the movie, not to finish it.

I’ll agree Snyder could use a steady hand to guide him through certain things he’s not super good at… and it’s not wonder why BvS and JL were such a mess… Imagine having execs changing direction every 5 minutes… It’s actually a miracle any of it was done, tbh… =/


#6375

Whedon was brought in before Snyder left the project. He was doing the rewrites that Snyder would have shot if he hadn’t left the film and Whedon took over entirely.


#6376

That’s not really a contradiction of what I just wrote…

Also, I forgot to say: Here’s Sanyder’s biggest flaw: His tendency to pick REALLY hard, high profile and high budget projects… xD

He’d probably do better if he did some indie-er movies in between, because in the end, he’s basically an indie film-maker trapped inside of Michael Bay’s wallet.


#6377

Snyder didn’t have a complete film. He was going to be doing reshoots that Whedon had written. The only difference between the Justice League we got and the Justice League we would have gotten is that some sections are directed by Whedon.


#6378

:smile:

Listen, I’m not even gonna argue, 'cause in the end, I’d rather believe what some of the actors and people who actually worked in the movie have said than… well, you.


#6379

Maybe you’d believe Snyder himself.

Post-production isn’t a finished film even if some of the actors and crew have finished working on it and believe it’s in the can. Snyder obviously hadn’t finished, it’s not some sort of fake excuse to cover a takeover, extreme tradgedy in his personal life was why he left production.


#6380

What’s that got to do with anything?

Ugh, you know what? Sure… you guys win… not worth my time. Here have a cookie:


#6381

Michael Bay was trapped in the big-budget machine. I mean, that’s part of what Dark of the Moon was about.


#6382

I’m not trying to win anything, I’m sorry if I come across that way, sometimes I’m very matter-of-fact. You’re arguing that there was a false narrative which I thought was pretty unfair given the circumstances and reasons he himself gave as to why he left, so I posted that report as you hadn’t read or seen it.


#6383

I said it’s a “false narrative” because that’s not why they brought Whedon in. They brought him for script changes. He took over shooting those changes when Snyder stepped down…

I mean, shit Rory even posted it:

None of that changes the fact (according to a lot of insiders) that Snyder had already finished shooting the entire movie according to the script he had at that point. And yes, that’s not a “finished movie”, I know… but They could’ve just finished the edits and post and release it. That’s not what they did.

Also, you can’t “reshoot” if there’s not an original shoot. It’s not too hard to grasp.

Lastly, if Snyder had only stepped down because of a familiy tragedy, then why isn’t he working on the sequel to either JL or MoS? I mean, surely WB wouldn’t be as shitty as to not give him back his job when he felt ready to go back to work right? :roll_eyes: but granted, that’s all speculation, so to each their own.


#6384

This is untrue though. He was the director not the writer. Chris Terrio wrote the script, Whedon was replacing him, not Snyder. Snyder was continuing to direct the reshoots. Therefore he’d not completed the movie at all.


#6385

I’m just going by what insiders have stated… you might choose to believe them or not. It’s not “my” facts, it’s theirs.