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DC Cinematic Universe - Wonder Woman, Justice League and More


#3456

It’s not a simple Marvel/DC reader divide though, that’s what I was getting at.

But analysing tastes beyond that simple divide, yes, I guess that would be a good pointer.


#3457

Porn? I bet it’s porn.


#3458

Superman and Batman were probably my two favorite superheroes growing up. They still are, really. I’m actually probably harder on DC movies because I have a bigger affinity for the characters than I do any of the Avengers characters (Spider-Man and X-Men were the only Marvel comic characters I was really into growing up). I think I have a more solidified idea of what I want/expect from Superman, Batman, Wonder Woman, and Justice League movies than I do for Iron Man, Thor, Captain America, and Avengers movies. Probably not exactly fair, but it is what it is.


#3459

Oh I definitely like the Marvel movies less because I grew up on Marvel. The studio took a hatchet and chopped away most everything that is cool or interesting about Marvel to make it into movies, while to my eyes, DC has made more of an effort to keep that stuff in.

That said I’ve liked plenty of Marvel films and disliked plenty of DC so there is no hard and fast rule. In general I think the movies are fine for both studios, but I much prefer the comics with both universes.


#3460

Comics are what counts, the films just need to be entertaining.

I think a lot of the ‘bias’ talk is a load of bollocks really. Mark Kermode recently had a real go at that accusation in an email that there’s a real DC v Marvel thing. I don’t feel I have that bias a a comics fan, I just want a good movie, I’m not ever going to pretend I like Black Panther if it’s rubbish. As such it’s obviously completely imagined for film critics that don’t give a shit and probably need someone to point out the difference.

He’s given lukewarm reviews to a lot of Marvel movies I actually thought were better than he did but he praised Wonder Woman to the hilt as I think a lot of critics did. They pushed Dark Knight for a rare genre Oscar. A lot of DC movies have been messy and directionless I’m afraid.


#3461

I prefer the movies. I think the cinematic Guardians are a better set of characters than the comics Guardians were. They’re more defined, have more personality and depth, and the actors performances eclipse anything from the comics. I also think Thor and Loki are a huge upgrade over the comics. Hulk too. And I think cinema Stark is a better representation than the comic Stark.

On the other hand the comic X Men are clearly superior, I don’t think movie Spiderman has ever been better than comic Spidey and I think only Wonder Woman is an upgrade on the DC side.

Comics have the benefit of hundreds of stories compared to the handful of movies we’ll get, so we only compare the very best against everything movies have to offer.


#3462

But movie scripts take a year to write and get dozens of polishes before being filmed, they don’t have to be churned out monthly to order by one guy who may be writing 6 other simultaneous scripts. If movie scripts aren’t comparable with the very best comics have to offer, they’re doing something seriously wrong.


#3463

Do you really have such a low opinion of comic writers? You think they just churn their stories out, and don’t do draft after draft working on the best story possible? And they work with unlimited visual budgets. And don’t have the issue of having to serve as big a mainstream audience as possible. To me it couldn’t be debated that the best comics are going to be far superior to the best comic movies. They just don’t have the same confines.


#3464

I think that comic writers write the best stories possible in the commercial environment they’re expected to work in. If comic writers were given movie-writer amounts of time to polish a script, how extra-awesome would they be?

The fact that the best comic stories are better than the movies shows how good comic writers can be.


#3465

We see entertainment news stories all the time: “So-and-so is scripting The Blockbuster Movie” (a year later) “Whatsizface has been brought in to polish the Blockbuster Move script”. While Comic Writer Guy is thinking, “Huh, I’ve written 48 scripts this year, what’s So-and-so been doing?”


#3466

And none of those examples are how the writing game really works at all.


#3467

I would grant you that the Thor character is better on screen but the Thor world is not.

In general it’s more to do with overall vibe, the gang of high fiving jocks and bros who sit at the popular kids table and crack jokes and don’t remotely seem to live in the same world as everyone else. It’s probably what Marvel had to become to be successful with movie audiences but it’s just not what Marvel is to me.


#3468

#3469

I don’t agree with this, but I did like the direction they went with them for the movies… well the first one that is…


#3470

Well Drax wasn’t anything in the comics but he’s great in the movies. Groot wasn’t much either, he’s much more loveable in his cinematic form. Rocket is just the same, Star Lord is an improvement I think as this Quill is a bit more Han Solo and buffonish, compared to comic Star Lord who was whatever the story needed him to be. Gamora is arguably the only downgrade, but her rivalry with Nebula makes her a tad interesting and 3 dimensional. She’s not as badassed and tough as she is in the comic which is a bit of a shame.

Meanwhile you have Yondu as a bonus. Mantis was a bit of a punchline character in the movie but at least she was funny. It’s really missing Cosmo and Bug, hopefully we eventually see more of them. And losing Vance Astro and Starhawk is no big loss.


#3471

Rocket is the same yeah, Drax was a bit more fearsome and just plain bad-ass in the CB (although I do like his movie personality better), Groot was a joke gone too far in the CB, but it’s pretty much the same in the movie, and Gamora was better in the cb (although she got some heavy retcons too).

Star Lord however was a LOT better in the Giffen/DnA period, he was an older (though he got soft-retconed too), more experienced and more tortured character, but not because some lame daddy issues, but because what he did as Star Lord and his regret at commiting genocide. It was a much better motivation than “oh I wonder who’s my daddy”…

Agreed on the rest, even Mantis was a bit of a punchline in the book. Yondu is awesome in the movie, and we definetly needed more Cosmo =(

Oh and btw, just as to stay on topic, I like quite a bit the personalities Snyder decided for the trinity in the movies, warts and all… I think they’re very intersting interpretations of the character… Add Lex & Zod on the list as well.


#3472

Look, if they’re gonna do a flash movie and are planning to make it flashpoint, then they should just go ahead and do it. The movie will basically serve as a reboot like what the comic did. Batman becomes younger so they recast that role since Affleck wants out. Keep Gal, Fisher, Momoa, Miller, in their respective roles. Cavill stays on as Superman of course. Then they can just put Hal Jordan and John Stewart as part of the Justice League like they were always there. Martian Manhunter is also there as a founding member while Cyborg becomes a founding member of the Titans with Dick Grayson. They can even rewrite their history and say that instead of fighting steppenwolf, they fought Starro when they came together or they fought white martians. And then just go from there.


#3473

#3474

Would have been pretty cool.


#3475

Zatanna’s outfit looks terrible. Everyone else looks good.