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DC Cinematic Universe - Wonder Woman, Justice League and More


#3376

He’s correct in terms of Justice League. MoS to BvS there seemed like a good amount of time with planning because they were establishing their universe. But BvS to JL was too quick, especially with the studio obviously wanting a different tone for JL, after the reception to BvS they didn’t have time to enforce major changes and make a memorable film. It all felt rushed, like the movie.


#3377

Nolan’s view is that filmmakers should be left to work at their own pace. As a filmmaker who is left to work at his own pace it’s hardly surprising that he thinks this.

It’s not that he doesn’t have a point, it’s just that it’s not the only point, and certainly not the only reason that Warner Bros have a superhero problem.


#3378

It is a recent development really though and not one only Nolan has issues with. A sequel before Harry Potter generally appeared 3-4 years after the first. Kenneth Branagh and the first Hunger Games guy who’s name escapes me had similar issues, not with making a sequel but jumping immediately into it.

It’s true the schedule is only one part of it though, the DC movies I think have been messy due to changes in direction and plans. There was supposed to be a Man of Steel 2, there was supposed to be a JLA 2 part series, Marvel have pretty much kept to what they always promised apart from Inhumans seems to be ditched.


#3379

#3380

Freddy?


#3381

According to an extensive new report in Variety, Warner Bros. is looking to revamp the DCEU in the wake of Justice League’s disappointing release. The superhero ensemble, which enlisted Joss Whedon for reshoots, made just $570.3 million worldwide in its first three weeks of release, compared to the $1.5 billion take for The Avengers. Warner Bros.’ restructuring of DC Films will begin in January as executives are said to be unhappy with the poor performance of Justice League, which could be attributed in part to the film being a product of two directors.

Zack Snyder, who was forced to exit production due to a family tragedy, will remain involved as a producer and executive producer on upcoming films, including Wonder Woman 2 — though he’s not expected to direct any future projects in the DCEU.

The report also doubles down on Ben Affleck’s heavily-rumored exit; while he’s set to return in The Flash, he’ll be recast in The Batman. Matt Reeves, who replaced Affleck at the helm of the Dark Knight’s new solo film (and promptly tossed out his screenplay), is reportedly looking for a younger actor to take on the role. A recent rumor suggested Reeves is interested in Jake Gyllenhaal for the part, but it may still be quite some time before the next Batman is revealed.

I didn’t realise the plan was still to do The Flash before The Batman, considering Flash has no director.


#3382

C’mon Warners, just get it over with and tell Disney how much you’d sell for…


#3383

It’s interesting how history is subtly rewritten. The story talks about how an early version of Justice League was too dark and Warner Bros wanted changes.

My understanding (second hand of course) is that they were making changes from the first day of filming. The script (which was still being worked on) was dark, and the expected rewrites during filming (it’s totally normal to keep writers on the production in a big studio film) were creating a lighter version of everything as they went along, at the request of Warner Bros.

Whedon was consulting while Snyder was still directing (as he was developing the Batgirl film) and then he stepped in when Snyder left to be with his family.

That’s all streamlined, as if they had actual Snyder version that were solid and set and then changed after he left. Nothing was solid, nothing was set. It was an evolving production. Snyder was working with Warner Bros, albeit from his point of view of things.

As for Affleck, I still like his approach to the character but if he’s fed up and wants to leave I wouldn’t blame him.

Reeves ability to recast the role illustrates, more than anything else, how different Warner Bros is to Marvel.

Can you imagine if Marvel hired a director and they wanted to recast Thor? They’d be lucky to get cab fair home.


#3384

They did recast Hulk though.


#3385

Marvel recast Hulk. Not a director who saw the character differently.


#3386

From the cited Variety article:

Warners is expected to name a new person to run point on DC’s films. Geoff Johns, who has partnered with Berg on much of the creative direction of the movies, is expected to continue serving as DC Entertainment’s chief creative officer. Johns, who reports to DC president Diane Nelson, works in areas such as television (and has written various episodes for DC-inspired shows), publishing, and consumer products, in addition to his contributions to the films. Going forward, his work on the films may evolve, and could be more advisory in nature.

So what exactly has he currently been doing in regards to the films? Are they going to bring him closer in or phase him out?

This was also interesting:

These people also say that Emmerich is weighing the idea of further integrating DC’s film operations into the studio’s main movie arm. That would entail putting the divisions under the same roof rather than having DC remain in a separate building on the lot, sources say. Marvel, which is owned by Disney, does operate its comic book film division autonomously, but other studios, such as Fox and Sony, produce their superhero films under the studio’s banner.

I wonder if one of the effects of this is that the films are not as interconnected as was originally planned.


#3387

Looking at it, I’d see the Warners film problems being:

They have no vision of what they want the films to be, they’ve been reacting to Marvel. In that respect the 'gods among us ’ angle works but needs to be done far better.

No one likes a cheat and Warners looked like that with BvS. Marvel had put in the time and work and got rewarded for that, Warners tried to steal the blueprint, speed it up and ended up with a mess. I love the Doomsday fight, the extended cut helps on the plot, but it’s still a mess that relies on a guilt-tripped Batman.

Will get to JL next year but I suspect it’ll follow the same pattern: There’ll be some good bits in there, but badly expressed.


#3388

#3389

I can’t help but notice how Wan takes pains in that article to stress how distinct his film is from Justice League.


#3390

I’m be honest. I can’t say I’m incredibly interested in a DCEU that they strip Snyder out of.


#3391

Warners should appreciate the successes they’ve had. It’s not all doom and gloom. Man of Steel successfully made Superman a success again and Wonder Woman was a huge hit. Aquaman looks to be a fan favorite. They need to do surgery rather than kill the patient and start over.


#3392

Me neither. Especially if they’re aiming for the Legion of Doom.
Snyder is one-half of the team that made Lex magic.


#3393

There was one area in which they were way ahead of Marvel, and that is having a movie with a female lead (well, Suicide Squad had a woman co-lead but close enough), and they’ve done it twice now while we’re still waiting on Marvel to do this a decade later.

It’s also notable that Suicide Squad and Wonder Woman were their biggest post-Nolan successes. I think they’d be wise to think about their line holistically from that lens, as a big tent where the notion of the white male alpha is shaken up. A quick look at current events shows the time is right, and Snyder was smart to make Cyborg the lead character of JL—the studio was dumb to overturn him.

Anyway they need to get that Whedon Batgirl out, get that Wonder Woman sequel out, get that Gotham City Sirens out, and Birds of Prey, get moving on it. The audience is ready.

I’d hold off on Batman for a few years until you have a better feel for the lay of the land, and also make people miss him a little bit. But I’d consider using Superman but finding ways to build off of Superman’s crowd-pleasing moments in the Justice League movie. It was actually a nice glimpse at how Superman could work on the big screen, where all of these heroes are pretty good and then Superman just blows them away, while also treating them with respect as equals. They can build off of that.


#3394

They wussed out on Snyder’s vision. He had a particular vision, a different one from the MCU/Fox/Sony ones… but they panicked or something… They first tried to shoe-horn Batman into the MoS sequel to fast-track the JL movie…

And hey despite everything, Snyder sort of made it work, not perfectly or anything, but at the very least the Extended Cut is a cohesive movie (with too much going on of course) that was okay. The one mistake they did was cut it down for time. It was the one thing they HAD to learn from the whole BvS debacle… and they did the same stupid thing with JL apparently.

Shit, they even mangled SQ because of their stupidity, and even despite that, SQ at least was trying to do something special and different.

So you know what? I feel bad for Snyder, and I really hate that we’ll probably never get to see what his plans were, but fuck Warner. They deserve every bit of flack they’re getting for wussing out like chumps.

So yeah, let them do their dancing chairs all they want and churn out more of those bland MCU-like WW movies. They might make some money with those, sure.


#3395