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Comics - Everyone Else (NOT Marvel / DC)


#2950

The publisher doesn’t write the books - guys like Ennis, Moore, Ellis do, some of the most single minded and wonderfully gifted writers of all time

I don’t get that line of thought at all that rules out an entire publisher’s line, when the comics are completely writer driven.

Edit to add -
They might market more extreme variant covers to which each individuals tolerance may vary, but they are marketed towards the folk who want that sort of thing - just don’t buy the variants

Bottom line is, Jason and others of that line of thought are missing out if some of the best comics published in the last 20 years or so because of a sweeping generalisation borne from a degree of ignorance


#2951

I don’t think anyone here is doing that, I think most people have read at least one or two Avatar books that they’ve liked.

But I can understand Jason’s suggestion that a retailer might look at their line, and the general tone of the books they publish, and say ‘no thanks’. Even Avatar’s own press release that I posted earlier on seems to acknowledge that this is happening.


#2952

The boundless stuff I can see why folk wouldn’t touch it out of personal taste as it is clearly marketed for a specific target audience


#2953

Yep, and I think that’s why they house it under a separate imprint.


#2954

Another possible issue with Avatar is their Kickstarters - I wonder whether their already fairly niche audience is being cannibalised by their advance Kickstarters, so that when books finally hit the shelves of LCSs there just aren’t that many readers left to buy them. (And maybe LCS owners aren’t happy at being gazumped by advance sales through KS.)

Maybe going to their fans directly and ignoring the direct market is the best model for Avatar at this point, especially if stores are stopping ordering their books altogether.


#2955

the art seems very publisher driven.


#2956

“Ignorance?”

JFC… I never said I didn’t read their books. I’ve actually read and bought quite a few; all of the Alan Moore titles, and a number of the Ellis, Ennis, and other titles from prominent writers. I probably own three hundred or more of their comic books.

So I know exactly what they are like.

A lot of that stuff is schlocky. There’s a lot of gratuitous, exploitive nudity and violence and gore that’s really only there to shock. (coughCrossed*cough) Combine that with some dodgy artwork, garish colors, half a dozen variant covers per issue, ads in the back for more variant covers, weird-smelling paper, and you have a publisher that’s going to come off as cheesy. It’s not surprisng they’re getting overlooked when they’re the company that puts out variant covers with women gettng sawed in half through their crotches.

(Though I can appreciate that their books are printed on heavier paper stock, it reeks.)

It also doesn’t help when they’re pushing ALAN MOORE comics that are actually written by Antony Johnston. Which I’ve always found a bit strange considering that Moore will demand his name be taken off of things he actually did write, but is content to use his name to sell things he didn’t actually write…

I’m sorry, but it’s hard to take a publisher that outs out stuff like this seriously:

At best, that says “I bought this because I want to freak out my mother.”

Edit: Spoilered the graphic image. I appreciate what was being relayed but this board is meant to be all ages. - Ronnie M


#2957

And they have always had a weird smell!

I never understood why they didn’t do something about that.


#2958

Something else to consider about Avatar:

In addition to the Boundless line, they also bankroll Rich Johnson’s Bleeding Cool website.

There product line has dropped to almost nothing. I think ad revenue from Bleeding Cool may be the only thing keeping the company afloat. I wouldn’t be surprised if one day we hear Avatar is shutting down.


#2959

Who is being exploited?

What you call schlocky is just down to your own tastes.

If you don’t like it of course you are entitled not to read it and express your dislike, but I don’t think it is fair to write it off altogether as trash just because it is not your bag.

There seems to be more of a problem depicting sexuality or violence in American comics or to the American comic book audience than there is in Europe.

I don’t know why that it exactly but it’s not a problem in countries like France & Japan who have been publishing erotic and often violent comic books for decades, consumed by mainstream audiences that (as far as I’m aware) dwarf the sales numbers of that of even DC and Marvel.


#2960

Honestly this is some Mary Whitehouse style shit going on in this thread right now.


#2961

It’s a bit naive to think that Avatar aren’t shooting for this kind of outrage. It’s pretty obvious that they are trying to push these buttons. Having an aversion to the purposeful graphic material and image that they court is far from Puritanical.

Also, I’ve always seen them as a bit of a fly-by-night operation. It’s always made me scratch my why people choose to work with them.


#2962

I find it hard to believe that Alan Moore would let a publisher decide how his comics should look.


#2963

If you look at Avatar’s offerings, they have a very house style. Once again, I’m not sure why anyone would work with them much less Moore.


#2964

Why would Moore and Ennis - one who notoriously will only work with publishers he trusts and sees as ethical & having integrity, the other who will only work with publishers if he gets the freedom to do what he wants - have lasted so long with them if they are fly by night Ronnie?

It doesn’t make sense to me at all here?

I also don’t think Moore, Ennis and Ellis would take kindly to their work being reduced to its purpose being designed to shock.


#2965

I meant to pick up on this same point earlier


#2966

You are not the first person to say this on the thread, or at least allude to it…it seems quite an unreasonable viewpoint, I don’t get where it’s coming from.


#2967

First, I’m not as convinced as some about Moore’s integrity. It seems to be more about pride and the inability to let go of a grudge. I’m not as familiar with Ennis. Second, I have no idea which is why I said exactly that.

Do you honestly think Avatar’s output has some altruistic intent? What do you feel is the purpose of the cover that @Jason posted above? Some of their actions are a bit hard to defend.


#2968

Why do you feel so attached to Avatar and like you should go to the wire to defend them? Do you or has someone you know worked for them?

I’m honestly not trying to attack you here. I’m just very perplexed at your aversion to them being typified by what seems to fairly obviously be their intent.


#2969

I don’t think they have altruistic intent.
I think they are a form of entertainment and art and I’m not a fan of censorship in art of any form, whether that be comics, works of art or movies etc

If it evokes a feeling or there is an audience for it, I think it’s a valid artform. I don’t think it’s fair to dismiss the work of these creators and artists who have probably put a lot of their time and effort into this work.

I don’t think it’s designed to shock, for the sake of shock, I think it’s designed to produce a reaction of horror or titilation, depending on the image.